CovValleyBoy
Well-Known Member
I think if you can get a couple of million for Eccles he should be offski
I think if you can get a couple of million for Eccles he should be offskiI can’t find stats on honour killings specifically but “honour based abuse” stats don’t have it in the breakdown so I’m going to say it’s very rare.
On whether it’s changing again stats are hard to come by but this is quite in depth on Muslim social attitudes (and attitudes towards Muslims) and suggests younger Muslims are generally more socially liberal than older Muslims which would both make sense and suggest there is liberalisation going on:
I can’t find stats on honour killings specifically but “honour based abuse” stats don’t have it in the breakdown so I’m going to say it’s very rare.
On whether it’s changing again stats are hard to come by but this is quite in depth on Muslim social attitudes (and attitudes towards Muslims) and suggests younger Muslims are generally more socially liberal than older Muslims which would both make sense and suggest there is liberalisation going on:
Yeah, I would agree there is some liberalisation too, you can see it some countries in the middle east as well. Question is, is it enough? I don't feel like it is at all. The stats on views towards gay people for example, are well off where they should be. The last poll I checked had about 50% of British muslims thinking homosexuality should be illegal. It's going to need a lot of work if the population percentage increase is going to keep going.
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So not a million miles off Anglican beliefs twenty years ago basically.
I agree there’s work to be done. The only outright homophobia I’ve ever heard at work came from a Muslim woman that no one felt they could challenge and that’s wrong. But that stat you’re quoting drops to 28% with 18-24 year old Muslims which puts them around British Christian levels.
Again I think the answer is more integration and time. But my point if that the stats are heading in the right direction. They’re generally what you’d expect from older and recent immigrants vs second generation or younger and that suggests that far from an islamification of Britain there’s a westernisation of Muslims that immigrate.
You don’t need to ban Islam (that would be counterproductive IMO) or restrict immigration, I’d argue you do need to make sure that kids are growing up around a diverse group of peers.
Some good points there, but I still stand by what I say in general. Going backwards twenty years to go forward makes little to no sense to me. There is some tolerance as Islam is in the minority in this country, I feel that this tolerance will change as that population increases to a certain point, rather than going the other way. Once Islamists hit a certain threshold and get into the parliament, I think we will see some laws in Europe will start to change to reflect Islamic ideals and values. At present everything is pointing to an increase in Muslim population.
I cannot think of a single country in the world where Islam is not the dominant culture and mixes with other religions and values successfully. There always seems to be issues, and frankly we have got enough of our own already. I don't agree on a ban, like you, but I do think we need to stop importing so many people from many of these countries that do have such backward views in such numbers. You might be right, it might level out, but I think that is where we disagree. My feelings are that we are going to see quite a negative culture shift in the years to come.
It’s a long way from 8% to 51% at a rate of roughly 1% a decade. “Years to come” is doing a lot of work and predicting decades ahead is beyond anyone TBH.
And they “call” boomers and blame them for all their problems.Yeah it's called life. It's called work ethic.
Too many can't handle the rigor & the grind.
The ones that do have relative success.
The ones that don't live on welfare its a better option than what was once available , absolute poverty.
Couldn't have asked for a more perfect post to prove my point. The idea that the problem will be fixed by simply telling people to shut up, ignore the issues and work harder is a complete head in the sand. All the data indicates the opposite is happening.Yeah it's called life. It's called work ethic.
Too many can't handle the rigor & the grind.
The ones that do have relative success.
The ones that don't live on welfare its a better option than what was once available , absolute poverty.
Not if you drop deal before retirement you can't.It can pay spiritually & financially. If "you" reach the sunny uplands one can look back on a life well lived.
& the grind is in the past.I feel sorry for those who don't have the "work ethic" at their core particularly in their early adulthood.
If you're concerned about a huge influx of people in a relatively short space of time you probably need to be looking at global warming as the number of climate refugees we are likely to see in the coming years will absolutely dwarf the numbers now.It don't think it will continue at 1% a decade. In fact, it's already more than that, and that doesn't account for the latest statistics which would include the masses of immigration since Brexit from largely non-eu Muslim majority countries.
We can't predict everything, you are right. We can however look at other examples and align the patterns. It's a fairly new phenomenon in Europe (although there's enough evidence of the trajectory - parts of Belgium, NL, Sweden, France, Germany etc), but there are many countries in Africa and the Middle East where you've seen Islam grow and become dominant - with pretty hostile consequences for non-belivers.
In my eyes it's pretty clear where things will go eventually. We might have to just agree to disagree on this one! Appreciate the good spirit debate though.
YepIf you're concerned about a huge influx of people in a relatively short space of time you probably need to be looking at global warming as the number of climate refugees we are likely to see in the coming years will absolutely dwarf the numbers now.
Entire countries and continents are well on the way to becoming uninhabitable.
YepEnergy Secretary insists energy bills will be cut by £300 a year by 2030
The overhaul of the energy system is designed to protect consumers from energy price spikes, like that seen in the recent gas crisis, boost energy security and tackle climate change. But the rush to get to clean power by 2030 risks increasing certain short term costs, some analysts warned.news.sky.com
Does anyone think Miliband's 'promise' to cut energy bills by £300 p.a. will be fulfilled?
wholesale prices should be lower if we invest in renewables but whether that gets passed on to the consumer I have my doubts.Energy Secretary insists energy bills will be cut by £300 a year by 2030
The overhaul of the energy system is designed to protect consumers from energy price spikes, like that seen in the recent gas crisis, boost energy security and tackle climate change. But the rush to get to clean power by 2030 risks increasing certain short term costs, some analysts warned.news.sky.com
Does anyone think Miliband's 'promise' to cut energy bills by £300 p.a. will be fulfilled?
wholesale prices should be lower if we invest in renewables but whether that gets passed on to the consumer I have my doubts.
how is the £300 calculated, is there some adjustment for inflation because £300 cheaper than what you pay today with years of inflation seems unlikely so presumably it gets inflation adjusted along the way and means your 2030 bill will be £300 cheaper than it would have been which is likely to come down to how things are calculated.
I know all politicians lie, especially to get into power
However I genuinely don't think we've seen a government proven to have been lying on such a huge scale, so quickly into their term
I know all politicians lie, especially to get into power
However I genuinely don't think we've seen a government proven to have been lying on such a huge scale, so quickly into their term
I think social media is undermining them completely and they didn’t stand a chanceI know all politicians lie, especially to get into power
However I genuinely don't think we've seen a government proven to have been lying on such a huge scale, so quickly into their term
Perfect example of attacking from the right and left in that articleWhy did Starmer U-turn on winter fuel payments? Every Labour policy shift explained
The Independent looks at all the times Sir Keir Starmer has let voters down or outright U-turned on his promises on the journey from Labour leader to prime ministerwww.independent.co.uk
Here’s one that appears more balanced but I’ve been told full fact is funded by the government so isn’t independent I’m not so sure
Government Tracker – Full Fact
Full Fact is monitoring the government’s delivery on its promisesfullfact.org
They're not even trying to hide it.
At the next election both Labour and the Conservatives deserve nothing more than a total whitewash defeat. The problem is, I have no faith in the general public using their brains and voting for anything other than a 'safe choice', and I have next to no faith there is anyone else out there willing to step up and fill this void with any kind of common sense approach and policies.
What they're getting away with at present is absolutely shocking, though. I agree with you.
I’m not passing judgement or comment on the council tax announcement as, to be honest, I’ve no idea on the detail. The one thing I will say is that clearly economic and geopolitical conditions have changed, and it’s understandable some of Labour’s policies have to change as a result.
In fairness, there’s also plenty that they’ve reneged on or simply fucked up that wasn’t really reliant on certain market conditions. As an example, replacing OFSTED one-word judgements to…a variety of either one-word or two-word judgements. That’s just plain incompetence and a lack of understanding of the underlying issue.
As has been referenced in the Trump thread, their messaging and PR has been pretty pants, even on the good stuff they’ve done, and that I think will kill them when 2029 rolls around.
I think they'll be fine in 2029, that's why they 're burying all of the shit early on. It will be sunshine and roses for the last two years and voters have relatively short memories. The Conservatives are also in such disarray I think two terms minimum. Especially as I think their vote will be even more populised into Reform in lots of areas, but without enough support to have any real impact.As has been referenced in the Trump thread, their messaging and PR has been pretty pants, even on the good stuff they’ve done, and that I think will kill them when 2029 rolls around.
I think they'll be fine in 2029, that's why they 're burying all of the shit early on. It will be sunshine and roses for the last two years and voters have relatively short memories. The Conservatives are also in such disarray I think two terms minimum. Especially as I think their vote will be even more populised into Reform in lots of areas, but without enough support to have any real impact.
I know all politicians lie, especially to get into power
However I genuinely don't think we've seen a government proven to have been lying on such a huge scale, so quickly into their term
I’m not passing judgement or comment on the council tax announcement as, to be honest, I’ve no idea on the detail. The one thing I will say is that clearly economic and geopolitical conditions have changed, and it’s understandable some of Labour’s policies have to change as a result.
In fairness, there’s also plenty that they’ve reneged on or simply fucked up that wasn’t really reliant on certain market conditions. As an example, replacing OFSTED one-word judgements to…a variety of either one-word or two-word judgements. That’s just plain incompetence and a lack of understanding of the underlying issue.
As has been referenced in the Trump thread, their messaging and PR has been pretty pants, even on the good stuff they’ve done, and that I think will kill them when 2029 rolls around.
It's amazing how short some peoples memories are.
Arguably the key flaghship policy (as part of Brexit): Reduce immigration - went completely the opposite direction to record levels
40 new hospitals
Reduce A&E waiting times
More GPs
Promise not to raise tax (as with immigration, also went to record levels)
More prisons/prison places
300k more homes per year
Fix social care
Levelling up (particularly in the north)
Northern powerhouse rail
Energy cap/lower energy bills
Renter reform
End homelessness
Probably plenty more too.
All promised by the last government and failed, and in some cases made much worse.
In fairness to Saddle, I don't think he said they weren't useless too. It shouldn't be whataboutery but more about what will be fixed now and what lies this lot are peddling. There are plenty of examples, but as I said they're under no pressure, they have weak opposition and this is the opportunity to bury all of this before they start delivering.It's amazing how short some peoples memories are.
Arguably the key flaghship policy (as part of Brexit): Reduce immigration - went completely the opposite direction to record levels
40 new hospitals
Reduce A&E waiting times
More GPs
Promise not to raise tax (as with immigration, also went to record levels)
More prisons/prison places
300k more homes per year
Fix social care
Levelling up (particularly in the north)
Northern powerhouse rail
Energy cap/lower energy bills
Renter reform
End homelessness
Probably plenty more too.
All promised by the last government and failed, and in some cases made much worse.
People have forgotten what early polling looks like for new governments. In 2015 Milliband was ahead. Thatcher was behind for her first three years. Current Labour polling is great by comparison. Reform really doing them a favour by taking the protest vote and the Tories by trying to be Reform.
Why are you ignoring early polling for the 1997 or 2001 Labour government?
It's amazing how short some peoples memories are.
Arguably the key flaghship policy (as part of Brexit): Reduce immigration - went completely the opposite direction to record levels
40 new hospitals
Reduce A&E waiting times
More GPs
Promise not to raise tax (as with immigration, also went to record levels)
More prisons/prison places
300k more homes per year
Fix social care
Levelling up (particularly in the north)
Northern powerhouse rail
Energy cap/lower energy bills
Renter reform
End homelessness
Probably plenty more too.
All promised by the last government and failed, and in some cases made much worse.
In fairness to Saddle, I don't think he said they weren't useless too. It shouldn't be whataboutery but more about what will be fixed now and what lies this lot are peddling. There are plenty of examples, but as I said they're under no pressure, they have weak opposition and this is the opportunity to bury all of this before they start delivering.
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