Coventry City - managerial graveyard? (1 Viewer)

CJparker · Feb 28, 2012

Look at the analysis below. It tells me that Coventry has increasingly become a managerial graveyard. Managers with promotion-winning pedigree and good records at the top level have been transformed into sacked wrecks who have (with the exception of Nilsson in Sweden) failed to have any notable success at any other club.

What have we done to ruin all these managers?

Nilsson
Before: player. After: Swedish league management

McAllister
Before: player. After: Less than 12 months at Leeds - sacked. Villa assistant. Currently unemployed

Black
Before: coach. After: coach, two short caretaker stints at Blues and Sunderland. Currently assistant to Steve Kean at Blackburn.

Reid
Before: Man City, Sunderland, Leeds. After: Thailand, Stoke assistant, Plymouth. Currently a pundit after being sacked by Plymouth this season whilst bottom of the 92.

Adams
Before: Fulham, Brentford (both P/M), Brighton, Leicster. After: Brighton, Port Vale, Sheffield Utd, Vale again (current)

Dowie
Before: Oldham, Palace, Charlton. After: QPR, Newcastle assistant, Hull (temp contract). Currently unemployed.

Coleman
Before: Fulham, Real Sociedad. After: Larissa, Wales (current, after being appointed as the only credible candidate)

Boothroyd
Before: Watford, Colchester. After: Northampton (current - right now bottom of the 92)

SkyBlue_Am · Feb 28, 2012

Without us and our ex managers Sky Sports News would be struggling to find reporters lolll

DukeOfCov · Feb 28, 2012

Would help if they were given more money to get in players...

johnniericoh · Feb 28, 2012

CJparker said:
Look at the analysis below. It tells me that Coventry has increasingly become a managerial graveyard. Managers with promotion-winning pedigree and good records at the top level have been transformed into sacked wrecks who have (with the exception of Nilsson in Sweden) failed to have any notable success at any other club.

What have we done to ruin all these managers?

Nilsson
Before: player. After: Swedish league management

McAllister
Before: player. After: Less than 12 months at Leeds - sacked. Villa assistant. Currently unemployed

Black
Before: coach. After: coach, two short caretaker stints at Blues and Sunderland. Currently assistant to Steve Kean at Blackburn.

Reid
Before: Man City, Sunderland, Leeds. After: Thailand, Stoke assistant, Plymouth. Currently a pundit after being sacked by Plymouth this season whilst bottom of the 92.

Adams
Before: Fulham, Brentford (both P/M), Brighton, Leicster. After: Brighton, Port Vale, Sheffield Utd, Vale again (current)

Dowie
Before: Oldham, Palace, Charlton. After: QPR, Newcastle assistant, Hull (temp contract). Currently unemployed.

Coleman
Before: Fulham, Real Sociedad. After: Larissa, Wales (current, after being appointed as the only credible candidate)

Boothroyd
Before: Watford, Colchester. After: Northampton (current - right now bottom of the 92)

In addition what about our Graveyard Strikers:

Below in chronological order since 2002/2003 and including 2011/2012 are the numerous strikers we have bought/loaned that have had previous reputations as competent goalscorers but ended up not making their mark:

PUSB

Julian Jochamin
Lee Hughes
Lee Mills
Andy Morrell
Patrick Suffo
Dele Adebola
Stern John
James Scowcroft
Leon MKenzie
Kevin Kyle
Leon Best
Robbie Simpson
Clinton Morrison
Freddie Eastwood

CJparker · Feb 28, 2012

In fairness, Best was good. Kyle was OK in flashes before it went pear-shaped, but he didn't arrive with a big reputation anyway. Dele and Stern John did alright for us. McKenzie was never going to get us 20 goals a season but did OK when called upon.

My favourite here is Morrison, put a good shift in for two whole seasons with little support, I think he was our top scorer 2 years running. Shouldn't have let him leave.

guicey15 · Feb 28, 2012

johnniericoh said:
In addition what about our Graveyard Strikers:

Below in chronological order since 2002/2003 and including 2011/2012 are the numerous strikers we have bought/loaned that have had previous reputations as competent goalscorers but ended up not making their mark:

PUSB

Julian Jochamin
Lee Hughes
Lee Mills
Andy Morrell
Patrick Suffo
Dele Adebola
Stern John
James Scowcroft
Leon MKenzie
Kevin Kyle
Leon Best
Robbie Simpson
Clinton Morrison
Freddie Eastwood

Wouldn't say we ruined Leon Best, shipped him off to Newcastle where he is now playing regular premier league football for top 10 side. Admittedly he was never prolific for us, but to count him as part of a 'stiker graveyard' is, in my opinion, incorrect

Colonel Mustard · Feb 28, 2012

It could just be that the majority of them aren't effective managers. It doesn't make CCFC a graveyard; the vast majority of managers are ineffective. And it certainly doesn't help that CCFC has a tendency of hiring those on the way down rather than on the way up. The two whose records hold up to scrutiny - Nilsson and Black - continued to have success on their own terms.

CJparker · Feb 28, 2012

Colonel Mustard said:
It could just be that the majority of them aren't effective managers. It doesn't make CCFC a graveyard; the vast majority of managers are ineffective. And it certainly doesn't help that CCFC has a tendency of hiring those on the way down rather than on the way up. The two whose records hold up to scrutiny - Nilsson and Black - continued to have success on their own terms.

Except that, between them, the less-fondly remembered managers Reid, Adams, Dowie and Boothroyd achieved five promotions to the top flight between them (not counting lower league promotions) before joining City.

Let's face it, we've had a lot of managers who've done well elsewhere and then fallen down at HR/Ricoh. It can't all be down to bad managers.

Blue Maniac · Feb 28, 2012

I don't think the premise of the first post is correct. One by one:

CJparker said:
McAllister
Before: player. After: Less than 12 months at Leeds - sacked. Villa assistant. Currently unemployed

Arguably it was the spell at Leeds that did for Gary Mac.

CJparker said:
Black
Before: coach. After: coach, two short caretaker stints at Blues and Sunderland. Currently assistant to Steve Kean at Blackburn.

Strange appointment in the first place. Cov had no effect.

CJparker said:
Reid
Before: Man City, Sunderland, Leeds. After: Thailand, Stoke assistant, Plymouth. Currently a pundit after being sacked by Plymouth this season whilst bottom of the 92.

Taking the Thailand job was a mistake. Had been living off his name and not his ability for years.

CJparker said:
Adams
Before: Fulham, Brentford (both P/M), Brighton, Leicster. After: Brighton, Port Vale, Sheffield Utd, Vale again (current)

Got lucky for one season at Leicester with a Premier League squad, came back down and made a pig's arse of it. Then did nowt at Cov. Was crap anyway.

CJparker said:
Dowie
Before: Oldham, Palace, Charlton. After: QPR, Newcastle assistant, Hull (temp contract). Currently unemployed.

Has lived off a third of a season at Palace for his entire managerial career.

CJparker said:
Coleman
Before: Fulham, Real Sociedad. After: Larissa, Wales (current, after being appointed as the only credible candidate)

The fact that he was a credible candidate for the Wales job suggests his career is alive and kicking.

CJparker said:
Boothroyd
Before: Watford, Colchester. After: Northampton (current - right now bottom of the 92)

Was never any good. A horrible appointment from the start.

No, Coventry isn't a graveyard for managers. You have, however, had a lot of entirely useless ones.

Colonel Mustard · Feb 28, 2012

CJparker said:
Except that, between them, the less-fondly remembered managers Reid, Adams, Dowie and Boothroyd achieved five promotions to the top flight between them (not counting lower league promotions) before joining City. Let's face it, we've had a lot of managers who've done well elsewhere and then fallen down at HR/Ricoh. It can't all be down to bad managers.

Sometimes the stars align: maybe they have a ridiculously strong squad; maybe the roar of sell-out home crowds does the trick; maybe they have fresh ideas and haven't been figured out as yet. Who knows?

The argument I would make is that a genuinely effective manager will extract the most out of his squad regardless of the league or circumstances; such success will be evident to all, they will be in demand, and you will see repetition. Guys like Adams can't blame CCFC for being at Port Vale - he's simply found his level.

Grendel · Feb 28, 2012

CJparker said:
Except that, between them, the less-fondly remembered managers Reid, Adams, Dowie and Boothroyd achieved five promotions to the top flight between them (not counting lower league promotions) before joining City.
Let's face it, we've had a lot of managers who've done well elsewhere and then fallen down at HR/Ricoh. It can't all be down to bad managers.

However the Colonel is correct in his analysis. For most of these managers success had been limited and their recent experiences had been failure. Dowie at charlatan was a disaster and he had the humiliating court debacle with simon Jordan. Ranson despite claims to be a football man appointed duds. Coleman was a whacky choice. Success was dubious and he never had managed a club at this level. Boothroyd was definately on the way down and seemed paranoid all the way though his tenure.
Adams was the only one who should have done better. However he seemed damaged by the disciplinary issues at Leicester cumulating in the no drinks at Christmas fiasco.

People keep citing experienced managers as failures well in our case this is true. Not because of experience but experience of failure. Upcoming league 1 or. 2 man is required who will see us as a real career progression move not just another payday.

mark82 · Feb 28, 2012

kduffy said:
However the Colonel is correct in his analysis. For most of these managers success had been limited and their recent experiences had been failure. Dowie at charlatan was a disaster and he had the humiliating court debacle with simon Jordan. Ranson despite claims to be a football man appointed duds. Coleman was a whacky choice. Success was dubious and he never had managed a club at this level. Boothroyd was definately on the way down and seemed paranoid all the way though his tenure.
Adams was the only one who should have done better. However he seemed damaged by the disciplinary issues at Leicester cumulating in the no drinks at Christmas fiasco.

People keep citing experienced managers as failures well in our case this is true. Not because of experience but experience of failure. Upcoming league 1 or. 2 man is required who will see us as a real career progression move not just another payday.

I agree. Our last few managers have been on their way down rather than on their way up.

Brighton Sky Blue · Feb 29, 2012

mark82 said:
I agree. Our last few managers have been on their way down rather than on their way up.

This tends to be as fans clamour for an established name rather than wanting to take a chance on an upcoming manager from lower down the ladder. I remember plenty of people insisting the likes of Gary Johnson and Steve Tilson replace Adams and Dowie-both have since gone on to fail in the bottom tier.

Otis · Feb 29, 2012

CJparker said:
Look at the analysis below. It tells me that Coventry has increasingly become a managerial graveyard. Managers with promotion-winning pedigree and good records at the top level have been transformed into sacked wrecks who have (with the exception of Nilsson in Sweden) failed to have any notable success at any other club.

What have we done to ruin all these managers?

Nilsson
Before: player. After: Swedish league management

McAllister
Before: player. After: Less than 12 months at Leeds - sacked. Villa assistant. Currently unemployed. Terrible manager anyway. He was absoloutely awful for us and one of our worst managers ever.

Black
Before: coach. After: coach, two short caretaker stints at Blues and Sunderland. Currently assistant to Steve Kean at Blackburn. We will never know if he would have made a good manager or not. We probably put him off managing for life!

Reid
Before: Man City, Sunderland, Leeds. After: Thailand, Stoke assistant, Plymouth. Currently a pundit after being sacked by Plymouth this season whilst bottom of the 92. His best days were well behind him when he came him and his career was on the wane.

Adams
Before: Fulham, Brentford (both P/M), Brighton, Leicster. After: Brighton, Port Vale, Sheffield Utd, Vale again (current) - Poor manager for us as he seemed to lose the dressing room. Once that happens you have no chance.

Dowie
Before: Oldham, Palace, Charlton. After: QPR, Newcastle assistant, Hull (temp contract). Currently unemployed. - Lived off the back of one successful season at Palace. Done nowt since.

Coleman
Before: Fulham, Real Sociedad. After: Larissa, Wales (current, after being appointed as the only credible candidate) - Just a very, very bad manager indeed. Absolutely clueless.

Boothroyd
Before: Watford, Colchester. After: Northampton (current - right now bottom of the 92)- Once again, maybe living off the back of one good season.

It's not all a great mystery.

Sumo the Micky Quinn · Feb 29, 2012

When we look at our two (three) most successful managers.

Jimmy Hill.

Before: Player & chairman of the Professional Footballers Association
After: TV Pundit.

John Sillett.

Before: Manager Hereford Utd 1974–1978 promotion to Div 2 (1976) relegated back to div. 3 (1977), Sillett resigned (Feb 1978). Came to City as coach in 1983-4 then returned 1985, made head coach in 1986 along side Curtis.

After: Manager Hereford Utd.

George Curtis.

Before: Commercial Manager at Coventry City in July 1974 and then Managing Director in September 1983.

After: Back in his Managing Director role.

BigCyrille · Feb 29, 2012

Could be wrong but I can't remember a Coventry manager getting *poached* by another team. Of course that would indicate some previous success, and since we're had none ......

The CableGuy · Feb 29, 2012

Regarding MA - This is the guy who got us our highest placed finish (8th) in this league, while making the Arena a fortress in its first season (I think we only lost 4 games at home that season).

At one point, WBA were after him.........but he's classed as shit and a poor manager? Ooooookkkkkayyy.

Sure, he lost the plot (and Macca) later on, but for closing league position alone, he's done better for us than any Manager since relegation.

shmmeee · Feb 29, 2012

johnniericoh said:
In addition what about our Graveyard Strikers:

Below in chronological order since 2002/2003 and including 2011/2012 are the numerous strikers we have bought/loaned that have had previous reputations as competent goalscorers but ended up not making their mark:

PUSB

Julian Jochamin
Lee Hughes
Lee Mills
Andy Morrell
Patrick Suffo
Dele Adebola
Stern John
James Scowcroft
Leon MKenzie
Kevin Kyle
Leon Best
Robbie Simpson
Clinton Morrison
Freddie Eastwood

What the hell is Robbie Simpson doing in that list?

Blue Maniac · Feb 29, 2012

shmmeee said:
What the hell is Robbie Simpson doing in that list?

And who is Julian Jochamin?

CJparker · Mar 1, 2012

Dowie has been very hard done by everywhere, so his record makes him look worse than he is:

Oldham - did really well and get the Palace job
Palace - got them into the Prem and nearly kept there against the odds
Charlton - only had a few games in charge: when he left you'd only lost 1 out of the last 6, despite a slow start
Cov - Ranson wanted to bring his own man (Coleman) in, previously the financial crisis at the club had prevented him from doing well, but stil lscored cup wins at Blackburn and Man U
QPR - did OK with them but not amazingly, even though he never saw the promised huge budget - just another victim of their trigger happy owners along with Gregory, Luigi Di Canio, Sousa etc
Hull - temp contract when they were already down

So he's managed to fall out with people rather than be an awful manager. Saying that, I'd rather not have him back.

Was slightly surprised he didn't go for the NI job which went to o'Niell. Also Magilton would be a strong contender for that.

Coventry City - managerial graveyard? (1 Viewer)

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