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Coventry City 2018/19 (2 Viewers)

  • Thread starter Westendlad
  • Start date Jul 29, 2018
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Sky Blue Harry H

Well-Known Member
  • Jul 30, 2018
  • #71
Grendel said:
Mid table would be a good finish what are you on about?
Click to expand...
Maybe Grendel, but before a ball is kicked, it's not what we are all secretly hoping for(particularly after the way last season finished -which was like having 3 mini cup finals on the bounce, and coming out on top!)
 

Irish Sky Blue

Well-Known Member
  • Jul 30, 2018
  • #72
For our club I think mid table In the third division would be a failure.
 
Reactions: martcov, Westendlad and Ashdown

Nick

Administrator
  • Jul 30, 2018
  • #73
Mid table wouldn't be a failure though would it for the first season back up?

People need to forget the whole premier league / top flight and the expectancy to just be up there.
 
Reactions: skyblueinBaku

clint van damme

Well-Known Member
  • Jul 30, 2018
  • #74
Irish Sky Blue said:
For our club I think mid table In the third division would be a failure.
Click to expand...

Not if we use it as a building block to improvement (as in a play off challenge) the following year.
We're far from the biggest club in league one so not sure why people think we should be automatically challenging.
 
Reactions: fernandopartridge

shmmeee

Well-Known Member
  • Jul 30, 2018
  • #75
clint van damme said:
Not if we use it as a building block to improvement (as in a play off challenge) the following year.
We're far from the biggest club in league one so not sure why people think we should be automatically challenging.
Click to expand...

Bollocks to building blocks, there's no such thing when you rebuild the entire squad each season. What did we build on top of our 8th place finish under Mowbray? A relegation.

At this level teams are roughly the same, our budget is in the mix and any success will be down to luck, hard work and momentum,not the result of years of careful planning.
 
Reactions: Westendlad and Ashdown

Grendel

Well-Known Member
  • Jul 30, 2018
  • #76
shmmeee said:
Bollocks to building blocks, there's no such thing when you rebuild the entire squad each season. What did we build on top of our 8th place finish under Mowbray? A relegation.

At this level teams are roughly the same, our budget is in the mix and any success will be down to luck, hard work and momentum,not the result of years of careful planning.
Click to expand...

There are and have been teams in this division with a wage bill 5 times ours
 

italiahorse

Well-Known Member
  • Jul 30, 2018
  • #77
Grendel said:
Mid table would be a good finish what are you on about?
Click to expand...
You want to finish mid table even before the season starts? Wow !!
 

clint van damme

Well-Known Member
  • Jul 30, 2018
  • #78
shmmeee said:
Bollocks to building blocks, there's no such thing when you rebuild the entire squad each season. What did we build on top of our 8th place finish under Mowbray? A relegation.

At this level teams are roughly the same, our budget is in the mix and any success will be down to luck, hard work and momentum,not the result of years of careful planning.
Click to expand...
There's quite clearly a different recruiting strategy now. With players bei g given longer contracts.
It may not bear fruit but it's certainly more conducive to building a team over a longer period that it was when we were filli g the squad with 6 month loanees.
 
Reactions: martcov, Westendlad and italiahorse

Nick

Administrator
  • Jul 30, 2018
  • #79
shmmeee said:
Bollocks to building blocks, there's no such thing when you rebuild the entire squad each season. What did we build on top of our 8th place finish under Mowbray? A relegation.

At this level teams are roughly the same, our budget is in the mix and any success will be down to luck, hard work and momentum,not the result of years of careful planning.
Click to expand...

We aren't rebuilding the entire squad every season, we have brought players in for League 1 after going up from League 2.
 

italiahorse

Well-Known Member
  • Jul 30, 2018
  • #80
Grendel said:
There are and have been teams in this division with a wage bill 5 times ours
Click to expand...
Is that your opinion or can you quote the facts.
 

shmmeee

Well-Known Member
  • Jul 30, 2018
  • #81
Grendel said:
There are and have been teams in this division with a wage bill 5 times ours
Click to expand...

Yet again you wrote words and failed to make a point.

Keep going though little buddy, you'll get there
 
Reactions: martcov, COVKIDSNEVERQUIT and italiahorse

clint van damme

Well-Known Member
  • Jul 30, 2018
  • #82
italiahorse said:
You want to finish mid table even before the season starts? Wow !!
Click to expand...

What a stupid comment.
No supporter wants to finish mid table but sometimes you have to accept that's realistic.
 
Reactions: fernandopartridge

shmmeee

Well-Known Member
  • Jul 30, 2018
  • #83
Nick said:
We aren't rebuilding the entire squad every season, we have brought players in for League 1 after going up from League 2.
Click to expand...

We spent 5 seasons in this division. We finished:

15, 18, 17, 8, 23

Wheres the progression?

Give me any evidence whatsoever that "building blocks" is an actual thing and not something you've made up.

I maintain that outside of a few outliers most teams in this division have similar wage bills, IIRC Pompeys was around the same as ours and people are tipping them for top 3. What matters is more luck than judgement.

We could easily finish anywhere from 3rd to 23rd, why not hope for the best?
 

italiahorse

Well-Known Member
  • Jul 30, 2018
  • #84
clint van damme said:
What a stupid comment.
No supporter wants to finish mid table but sometimes you have to accept that's realistic.
Click to expand...
Set a high bar to start surely?
The team is unknown at this level so I start with high expectations and get them refined as the season progresses like most years.
Stupid I know.
 

clint van damme

Well-Known Member
  • Jul 30, 2018
  • #85
shmmeee said:
We spent 5 seasons in this division. We finished:

15, 18, 17, 8, 23

Wheres the progression?

Give me any evidence whatsoever that "building blocks" is an actual thing and not something you've made up.
Click to expand...

So if we finish mid table next season and hit the play offs after that wouldn't you call that building?
I like what we're doing recruitment wise at the minute and definitely think we are building a team and squad but accept that the owners could revert Back to the previous shortermism at the drop of a hat..
 
Reactions: Esoterica

Nick

Administrator
  • Jul 30, 2018
  • #86
shmmeee said:
We spent 5 seasons in this division. We finished:

15, 18, 17, 8, 23

Wheres the progression?

Give me any evidence whatsoever that "building blocks" is an actual thing and not something you've made up.

I maintain that outside of a few outliers most teams in this division have similar wage bills, IIRC Pompeys was around the same as ours and people are tipping them for top 3. What matters is more luck than judgement.

We could easily finish anywhere from 3rd to 23rd, why not hope for the best?
Click to expand...

Give me evidence where I have used "building blocks". I said we haven't signed a whole new squad.

Pretty sure in those years we didn't have the same sort of recruitment and plan did we?

Of course it pays off to bring in players to help develop and then play for the first team, it's not much different to them coming from the academy but we either pick them up from other academies or non league.

I'd much rather some sort of plan for the future than the bring in random players like Hunt, Gadzev, Rose, Bigi (2nd time) and co in a blind panic. I'd much rather sign a Hyam and another youngster who may not make it rather than a Ramage.

Then you mix them with the experienced players like Brown, Doyle, Ogogo, Andreu and even players like Willis and Grimmer who have played a fair bit. Imagine if we were just signing players on 6 month contracts who were "names", people would be moaning about no future planning.
 
Reactions: Seb, Liquid Gold and clint van damme

clint van damme

Well-Known Member
  • Jul 30, 2018
  • #87
italiahorse said:
Set a high bar to start surely?
The team is unknown at this level so I start with high expectations and get them refined as the season progresses like most years.
Stupid I know.
Click to expand...

I'm optimistic, maybe misguidedly so. But if we do end up mid table I'll be philosophical about it. There are a lot of teams in this league with promotion ambitions.
We can't all go up.
 
C

CCFC_Charlie

Well-Known Member
  • Jul 30, 2018
  • #88
19th
 

Grendel

Well-Known Member
  • Jul 30, 2018
  • #89
shmmeee said:
Yet again you wrote words and failed to make a point.

Keep going though little buddy, you'll get there
Click to expand...

The fact Italia likes your post tells us all we need to know

It’s funny really. You often lecture people on lack of facts and lack of knowledge but post made up diatribe all the time.
 

Grendel

Well-Known Member
  • Jul 30, 2018
  • #90
shmmeee said:
We spent 5 seasons in this division. We finished:

15, 18, 17, 8, 23

Wheres the progression?

Give me any evidence whatsoever that "building blocks" is an actual thing and not something you've made up.

I maintain that outside of a few outliers most teams in this division have similar wage bills, IIRC Pompeys was around the same as ours and people are tipping them for top 3. What matters is more luck than judgement.

We could easily finish anywhere from 3rd to 23rd, why not hope for the best?
Click to expand...

What was Portsmouth’s wage bill? Can you link that one please.

People get lucky in cups not over a 46 game season
 

fernandopartridge

Well-Known Member
  • Jul 30, 2018
  • #91
Grendel said:
What was Portsmouth’s wage bill? Can you link that one please.

People get lucky in cups not over a 46 game season
Click to expand...
In 2 of the 5 seasons we had a 10 point deduction as well
 
Reactions: martcov, Sky Blue Pete and Grendel

Grendel

Well-Known Member
  • Jul 30, 2018
  • #92
fernandopartridge said:
In 2 of the 5 seasons we had a 10 point deduction as well
Click to expand...

I was going to see if he could figure that out by himself but then again
 

Grendel

Well-Known Member
  • Jul 30, 2018
  • #93
italiahorse said:
You want to finish mid table even before the season starts? Wow !!
Click to expand...

I’m not interested where wasps finish pal
 
Reactions: clint van damme

italiahorse

Well-Known Member
  • Jul 30, 2018
  • #94
Grendel said:
I’m not interested where wasps finish pal
Click to expand...
Deflection. No facts then?
 
Reactions: martcov

italiahorse

Well-Known Member
  • Jul 30, 2018
  • #95
Grendel said:
The fact Italia likes your post tells us all we need to know
It’s funny really. You often lecture people on lack of facts and lack of knowledge but post made up diatribe all the time.
Click to expand...

You made a quote about budgets to help your argument but provided no details.
At least either say it's an opinion or show us the facts.
 

Grendel

Well-Known Member
  • Jul 30, 2018
  • #96
italiahorse said:
You made a quote about budgets to help your argument but provided no details.
At least either say it's an opinion or show us the facts.
Click to expand...

Blackburn’s last published wage bill in the relegation season was £25 million, wolves still received parachute payments from the premier league when relegated, Sunderland have a wage bill in excess of £15 million, Wigan still has parachute payments when relegated, Bournemouth invested circa £15 million in the promotion season.

Enough said?
 
Reactions: clint van damme, Seb, fernandopartridge and 1 other person

italiahorse

Well-Known Member
  • Jul 30, 2018
  • #97
Grendel said:
Blackburn’s last published wage bill in the relegation season was £25 million, wolves still received parachute payments from the premier league when relegated, Sunderland have a wage bill in excess of £15 million, Wigan still has parachute payments when relegated, Bournemouth invested circa £15 million in the promotion season.

Enough said?
Click to expand...
Cheers
 

Esoterica

Well-Known Member
  • Jul 30, 2018
  • #98
shmmeee said:
We spent 5 seasons in this division. We finished:

15, 18, 17, 8, 23

Wheres the progression?

Give me any evidence whatsoever that "building blocks" is an actual thing and not something you've made up.

I maintain that outside of a few outliers most teams in this division have similar wage bills, IIRC Pompeys was around the same as ours and people are tipping them for top 3. What matters is more luck than judgement.

We could easily finish anywhere from 3rd to 23rd, why not hope for the best?
Click to expand...
Building blocks are:
A squad that all but 1 belong to us rather than max'd out with more loans than we're actually allowed to play in 1 match,
Players with a saleable value on contracts beyond the end of the current season
An academy feeding multiple players into the first team squad
A club with an increase in ST on the previous year
A club restoring bonds with it's fans and community

The team vs Notts County on the opening day last year:

O'Brien, Grimmer, Hyam, McDonald, Stokes, Kelly, Doyle (C), Vincenti, McNulty (Nazon 84'), Jones, Beavon (Biamou 72').
13 players used. 9 still ours, 2 moved on by our our choice, 1 expired loan and only 1 player left by their own choice.

That is a lot more judgement than luck and if we're successful again this year and if we do have any momentum to carry forward it'll be because of that, not in spite of it.
 

Gibbo

Well-Known Member
  • Jul 30, 2018
  • #99
Esoterica said:
Building blocks are:
A squad that all but 1 belong to us rather than max'd out with more loans than we're actually allowed to play in 1 match,
Players with a saleable value on contracts beyond the end of the current season
An academy feeding multiple players into the first team squad
A club with an increase in ST on the previous year
A club restoring bonds with it's fans and community

The team vs Notts County on the opening day last year:

O'Brien, Grimmer, Hyam, McDonald, Stokes, Kelly, Doyle (C), Vincenti, McNulty (Nazon 84'), Jones, Beavon (Biamou 72').
13 players used. 9 still ours, 2 moved on by our our choice, 1 expired loan and only 1 player left by their own choice.

That is a lot more judgement than luck and if we're successful again this year and if we do have any momentum to carry forward it'll be because of that, not in spite of it.
Click to expand...
Last Year O'Brien, Grimmer, Hyam, McDonald, Stokes, Kelly, Doyle (C), Vincenti, McNulty (Nazon 84'), Jones, Beavon (Biamou 72').
This year? Burge Grimmer Hyam Willis Brown Stirling Bayliss Ogogo/Doyle Alllesani Andreu Biamou (Jones, Kelly, Mason, JCH to come or in reserve)
Looks stronger to me
 
Reactions: Westendlad

itsabuzzard

Well-Known Member
  • Jul 31, 2018
  • #100
Esoterica said:
For me it's as much about how Robins decides to approach the season in terms of our own set up than the players themselves. For two thirds of last season it was two steps forward one step back and he struggled to get the balance right in our defensive/counter attacking set up.
This year there should be enough creativity in the team once Andreu, Jones are fully fit and Bayliss, Allassani up to speed with L1 and that should translate to there being much less pressure on 1 individual to carry the goal threat. Until that point though, I can see Robins starting the season very defensively again and reverting back to playing counter attack football utilising Sterling's pace, Bayliss' dribbles, long ball to JCH/Biamou. I'm hoping it will work better this year as we have pace on both flanks and aren't such a scalp meaning more teams will want a win at the Ricoh.
Really excited to see our shape/lineup on Saturday.
Click to expand...
Isn't two steps forward and one back a good thing?

Sent from my LG-H850 using Tapatalk
 

usskyblue

Well-Known Member
  • Jul 31, 2018
  • #101
itsabuzzard said:
Isn't two steps forward and one back a good thing?

Sent from my LG-H850 using Tapatalk
Click to expand...

We’ll finish above Paula Abdul m8
 

itsabuzzard

Well-Known Member
  • Jul 31, 2018
  • #102
usskyblue said:
We’ll finish above Paula Abdul m8
Click to expand...
Who does she play for?

Sent from my LG-H850 using Tapatalk
 

usskyblue

Well-Known Member
  • Jul 31, 2018
  • #103
itsabuzzard said:
Who does she play for?

Sent from my LG-H850 using Tapatalk
Click to expand...

The Tune Army I think m8
 

itsabuzzard

Well-Known Member
  • Jul 31, 2018
  • #104
A Geordie?
usskyblue said:
The Tune Army I think m8
Click to expand...

Sent from my LG-H850 using Tapatalk
 

Esoterica

Well-Known Member
  • Jul 31, 2018
  • #105
itsabuzzard said:
Isn't two steps forward and one back a good thing?

Sent from my LG-H850 using Tapatalk
Click to expand...
It is. But was also the difference between 6th and playoffs and seriously challenging for autos. Beat a good team, play 2 DMs at home and lose to a bottom 6 team.
 
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