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CCLSC conversation with TF (1 Viewer)

  • Thread starter ccfcway
  • Start date Jul 23, 2014
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skybluetony176

Well-Known Member
  • Jul 24, 2014
  • #71
mark82 said:
Is TF not chief executive? Generally CEOs have power to make these kind of decisions themselves. That is why they are paid so much.
Click to expand...

If that were true we wouldn't have hand shake gate and we never would have left the Ricoh or had the JR. TF may be the head but JS is the neck and she can turn the head whichever way she likes.

If she did back this proposal, regardless of if her name was added as a human error or not there would have been no need to ammend it on the clubs web site. Surely?
 

olderskyblue

Well-Known Member
  • Jul 24, 2014
  • #72
mark82 said:
Is TF not chief executive? Generally CEOs have power to make these kind of decisions themselves. That is why they are paid so much.
Click to expand...

Generally...you're right.

But you know this is NOT the case with TF, right?
 
G

Godiva

Well-Known Member
  • Jul 24, 2014
  • #73
skybluetony176 said:
If that were true we wouldn't have hand shake gate and we never would have left the Ricoh or had the JR. TF may be the head but JS is the neck and she can turn the head whichever way she likes.

If she did back this proposal, regardless of if her name was added as a human error or not there would have been no need to ammend it on the clubs web site. Surely?
Click to expand...

A CEO operates freely within the objectives set by the shareholders.
Something very important happened in January 2013 that changed the game and the objectives had to change as well.
The deal TF agreed was actually a deal proposed in late 2012 by JS when they still believed the club would obtain part ownership of the club. The bail out and the hostile public comments changed everything and I can understand why the owners had to rethink the situation.
 
K

Kingokings204

Well-Known Member
  • Jul 24, 2014
  • #74
Godiva said:
A CEO operates freely within the objectives set by the shareholders.
Something very important happened in January 2013 that changed the game and the objectives had to change as well.
The deal TF agreed was actually a deal proposed in late 2012 by JS when they still believed the club would obtain part ownership of the club. The bail out and the hostile public comments changed everything and I can understand why the owners had to rethink the situation.
Click to expand...

Really?
 
G

Godiva

Well-Known Member
  • Jul 24, 2014
  • #75
Kingokings204 said:
Really?
Click to expand...

No, I just made it all up.
 

skybluetony176

Well-Known Member
  • Jul 24, 2014
  • #76
Godiva said:
A CEO operates freely within the objectives set by the shareholders.
Something very important happened in January 2013 that changed the game and the objectives had to change as well.
The deal TF agreed was actually a deal proposed in late 2012 by JS when they still believed the club would obtain part ownership of the club. The bail out and the hostile public comments changed everything and I can understand why the owners had to rethink the situation.
Click to expand...

This is the worthless part she was willing to make a £2M donation to Higgs for because she's a good Christian? Didn't a Judge laugh at that? Hasn't it been exposed that there was never any real hunger to buy the Higgs share? That being the case how could Joy have thought the club would obtain part ownership if they never had the hunger to complete the deal? The judges words, not mine.
 

sky blue john

Well-Known Member
  • Jul 24, 2014
  • #77
mark82 said:
So why don't ACL call them out and agree to discuss the offer?
Click to expand...

Maybe they will maybe they won't but are you and Godiva happy to take that chance ?
 

mark82

Super Moderator
  • Jul 24, 2014
  • #78
Kingokings204 said:
Not in Jan/feb last year apparently.

And other point Mark. ACL won't contact sisu until the 2 criteria have been met and so far neither has. Simple surely.
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Personally think ACLs stance is a little unreasonable as I have explained before. They can make an agreement pending receipt of monies owed. I personally see asking someone to drop an appeal verging on blackmail. I don't believe Sisu will win or that they are in the right in any way but being able to appeal a courts decision is a basic civil liberty in this country.
 

mark82

Super Moderator
  • Jul 24, 2014
  • #79
sky blue john said:
Maybe they will maybe they won't but are you and Godiva happy to take that chance ?
Click to expand...

All I want is to be back in Coventry. That will take concessions and actions from BOTH sides to allow it to happen.
 

skybluetony176

Well-Known Member
  • Jul 24, 2014
  • #80
mark82 said:
Personally think ACLs stance is a little unreasonable as I have explained before. They can make an agreement pending receipt of monies owed. I personally see asking someone to drop an appeal verging on blackmail. I don't believe Sisu will win or that they are in the right in any way but being able to appeal a courts decision is a basic civil liberty in this country.
Click to expand...

If you dont believe SISU will win an appeal it sound more like ACL are doing them a favour than blackmailing them.

Other than that i agree, I also cant see why the FL cant come to a decision before the 7th of August.
 
G

Godiva

Well-Known Member
  • Jul 24, 2014
  • #81
skybluetony176 said:
This is the worthless part she was willing to make a £2M donation to Higgs for because she's a good Christian? Didn't a Judge laugh at that? Hasn't it been exposed that there was never any real hunger to buy the Higgs share? That being the case how could Joy have thought the club would obtain part ownership if they never had the hunger to complete the deal? The judges words, not mine.
Click to expand...

Maybe the judge got it wrong? It does happen, you know. His remarks were opinions, not quotes of the laws.
Let's wait until the appeals have been exhausted before we take a decision as gospel.
In the end the winner writes the history.
 

Nick

Administrator
  • Jul 24, 2014
  • #82
sky blue john said:
Maybe they will maybe they won't but are you and Godiva happy to take that chance ?
Click to expand...

I'd be really happy for them to at least start talking.
 
G

Godiva

Well-Known Member
  • Jul 24, 2014
  • #83
sky blue john said:
Maybe they will maybe they won't but are you and Godiva happy to take that chance ?
Click to expand...

Why wouldn't I be happy if ACL invites the club to discuss the offer?
 

skybluetony176

Well-Known Member
  • Jul 24, 2014
  • #84
Godiva said:
Maybe the judge got it wrong? It does happen, you know. His remarks were opinions, not quotes of the laws.
Let's wait until the appeals have been exhausted before we take a decision as gospel.
In the end the winner writes the history.
Click to expand...

Which Judge? The one in the Higgs case or the one that overseen the JR? Maybe both?

Do you not think it's more likely that SISU are wrong.

I'm exhausted by the appeals already and they haven't even started.
 

Nick

Administrator
  • Jul 24, 2014
  • #85
skybluetony176 said:
Which Judge? The one in the Higgs case or the one that overseen the JR? Maybe both?

Do you not think it's more likely that SISU are wrong.

I'm exhausted by the appeals already and they haven't even started.
Click to expand...

Wasn't it the same judge in both?
 
K

Kingokings204

Well-Known Member
  • Jul 24, 2014
  • #86
Not the same judge in both no. Wasn't it leggatt and higgenbottom?

Thing is though Godiva it's all Sisu's fault they moved out and they offered as tony says 2m and it was laughed out of court. It was sisu who started playing funny buggers not ACL.

It's common knowledge Higgs wanted or want out. 2million was derisory and rightly laughed out of court.
 

sky blue john

Well-Known Member
  • Jul 24, 2014
  • #87
Godiva said:
Why wouldn't I be happy if ACL invites the club to discuss the offer?
Click to expand...

Your stance was that you want Sisu to continue with the JR.
My question was are you happy with that decision if it means that Acl don't get round the table and begin negotiations ?
 

fernandopartridge

Well-Known Member
  • Jul 24, 2014
  • #88
Kingokings204 said:
Not the same judge in both no. Wasn't it leggatt and higgenbottom?

Thing is though Godiva it's all Sisu's fault they moved out and they offered as tony says 2m and it was laughed out of court. It was sisu who started playing funny buggers not ACL.

It's common knowledge Higgs wanted or want out. 2million was derisory and rightly laughed out of court.
Click to expand...
Is that relevant today? Is it relevant to a temporary rent deal? Is it relevant to the JR appeal (where a European Court may look more strictly at the legislation)?
 

sky blue john

Well-Known Member
  • Jul 24, 2014
  • #89
Godiva said:
Maybe the judge got it wrong? It does happen, you know. His remarks were opinions, not quotes of the laws.
Let's wait until the appeals have been exhausted before we take a decision as gospel.
In the end the winner writes the history.
Click to expand...

Lol !!
So your saying the judge made his decision based on opinion not law ?
 
G

Godiva

Well-Known Member
  • Jul 24, 2014
  • #90
sky blue john said:
Your stance was that you want Sisu to continue with the JR.
My question was are you happy with that decision if it means that Acl don't get round the table and begin negotiations ?
Click to expand...

If ACL decide they won't allow the club home on a short term deal because sisu won't drop the appeal, then I will blame ACL.
Absolutely.
It's blackmail and an attempt to obstruct the legal system where appeals is an important part.
 

ccfcway

Well-Known Member
  • Jul 24, 2014
  • #91
what are we paying and what are we getting in Northampton ?
 
G

Godiva

Well-Known Member
  • Jul 24, 2014
  • #92
sky blue john said:
Lol !!
So your saying the judge made his decision based on opinion not law ?
Click to expand...

No, I said his remarks were opinions.
 
K

Kingokings204

Well-Known Member
  • Jul 24, 2014
  • #93
Godiva said:
If ACL decide they won't allow the club home on a short term deal because sisu won't drop the appeal, then I will blame ACL.
Absolutely.
It's blackmail and an attempt to obstruct the legal system where appeals is an important part.
Click to expand...

I will try and take you to court for over a year and then I get battered in court and I still insist on appealing against you and see if you do a deal with me?

Is this for real? You're saying businesses should do deals with people who take them through stressful and costly court hearings. For real?
 

sky blue john

Well-Known Member
  • Jul 24, 2014
  • #94
Godiva said:
If ACL decide they won't allow the club home on a short term deal because sisu won't drop the appeal, then I will blame ACL.
Absolutely.
It's blackmail and an attempt to obstruct the legal system where appeals is an important part.
Click to expand...

No business in the world would deal with a company that is constantly trying to sue them !!
 

sky blue john

Well-Known Member
  • Jul 24, 2014
  • #95
Kingokings204 said:
I will try and take you to court for over a year and then I get battered in court and I still insist on appealing against you and see if you do a deal with me?

Is this for real? You're saying businesses should do deals with people who take them through stressful and costly court hearings. For real?
Click to expand...

Lol !!
I would think Godiva sees it as relationship building.
 

skybluetony176

Well-Known Member
  • Jul 24, 2014
  • #96
Godiva said:
If ACL decide they won't allow the club home on a short term deal because sisu won't drop the appeal, then I will blame ACL.
Absolutely.
It's blackmail and an attempt to obstruct the legal system where appeals is an important part.
Click to expand...

Agee mostly with you there. It's hardley black mail though is it? The appeal seems so hopeless given the summing up of the JR if anything they're offering SISU a way out that will save them some face.

But, however if sisu want to continue with it i dont se why it should be an issue seeing as they were willing to do a deal (though the FL) when the outcome of the JR was far from certain it shouldn't be a problem now.
 

lordsummerisle

Well-Known Member
  • Jul 24, 2014
  • #97
Kingokings204 said:
It's common knowledge Higgs wanted or want out. 2million was derisory and rightly laughed out of court.
Click to expand...

I don't know why CCC don't buy out Higgs and own it all themselves to be honest.

Though they thought that the "derisory" offer was more than it was worth I think from some of the documents during the Higgs case.
 
K

Kingokings204

Well-Known Member
  • Jul 24, 2014
  • #98
sky blue john said:
No business in the world would deal with a company that is constantly trying to sue them !!
Click to expand...

Apparently it's fine and won't stop a deal john. I can't believe what I read sometimes.

Hey I'm suing you for millions but can we still do a deal in the short term? Lol
 

sky blue john

Well-Known Member
  • Jul 24, 2014
  • #99
@ Godiva, you present a lot of well balanced arguments most of the time but this one you have lost the plot.
 
K

Kingokings204

Well-Known Member
  • Jul 24, 2014
  • #100
lordsummerisle said:
I don't know why CCC don't buy out Higgs and own it all themselves to be honest.

Though they thought that the "derisory" offer was more than it was worth I think from some of the documents during the Higgs case.
Click to expand...

I agree with that. Ccc could buy out Higgs and at least it sets them free from this saga then and then another company is out of the way.

As much as I think Godiva is crazy sometimes he does say one true thing and ccfc and ACL need to be the same people. A bit like Haskell wanted to do. It's the only way both can survive long term. ATM both are on life support.
 
G

Godiva

Well-Known Member
  • Jul 24, 2014
  • #101
Kingokings204 said:
I will try and take you to court for over a year and then I get battered in court and I still insist on appealing against you and see if you do a deal with me?

Is this for real? You're saying businesses should do deals with people who take them through stressful and costly court hearings. For real?
Click to expand...

This has nothing to do with 'you' or 'me' or 'Johnny' or 'Mary'.

It's a dispute between two businesses who greatly depend on each other. Who both suffers when they don't work together. Who can't in the short term satisfy their customers, business partners and their owners if they do not work together.
They disagree about a thing in the past - so they use the legal system to sort it out.
Customers and business partners depend on them to continue to work together while the historical dispute is settled in court.
 

fernandopartridge

Well-Known Member
  • Jul 24, 2014
  • #102
Kingokings204 said:
Apparently it's fine and won't stop a deal john. I can't believe what I read sometimes.

Hey I'm suing you for millions but can we still do a deal in the short term? Lol
Click to expand...
They're not suing anybody
 

sky blue john

Well-Known Member
  • Jul 24, 2014
  • #103
Its funny how some are using the words blackmail as part of their arguments !
Would you call with holding rent a form of blackmail ?
Would you call the threat of liquidation a form of blackmail ?
Would you call taking a club away from its city a form of blackmail ?
 

fernandopartridge

Well-Known Member
  • Jul 24, 2014
  • #104
Also John. I work in an organisation that can be simultaneously in dispute with a contractor whilst also allowing them to bid for further business. In the real world this does happen. Furthermore. The case is SISU against Coventry City Council. It isn't ACL.
 
K

Kingokings204

Well-Known Member
  • Jul 24, 2014
  • #105
fernandopartridge said:
They're not suing anybody
Click to expand...

What would you call it? They are doing it for the people of Coventry and making sure taxpayers money is spent correctly?
 
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