Article from a Sun Journalist (4 Viewers)

Sky Blue Kid · Jul 11, 2013

The Penguin...
If you're comfortable with that gamble, good for you. It may well pay off, and I sincerely hope it does. It is however more than likely that we'll do a Luton, continue to slide down the league into obscurity.

Never were truer words spoken mate.

DazzleTommyDazzle · Jul 11, 2013

Grendel said:
So you say all grounds equal. I ask again would last season under FPP would the club have been better off in a run down 18,000 capacity stadium or the Ricoh?

Surely the relevant question is: next season under FFP would the club be better off in a 7,000 capacity stadium or the Ricoh?

Mary_Mungo_Midge · Jul 11, 2013

Grendel said:
So he is wrong when he says only Leeds in the football league pay more rent? Is he wrong when he says we are the only club who does not benefit from other revenue sources? Go on then everyone. Tell is which other clubs have a worse deal and instead of the usual diatribe just answer the question which council run grounds on a day to day basis offer a WORSE deal.

The addict thing is unsavoury but what he is trying to get at us that people who rent a massive superstore may feel they are the biggest retailer in town but when they read the small print they are only allowed the proceeds akin to a corner shop.

Fans believe the Ricoh is ours. Ok so if we were at our owned ground with an 18,000 capacity would we have had more revenue last season in that ground or the Ricoh?

Let me give you an example as to why the basis of the piece, and your mindset is so errant. The Ricoh sponsorship, for example, is valued at £1m per season. That's not because it's a football stadium used in the third tier of football; as naming rights in this league are worth closer to £200 to £250K - it's because of the totality of the profile of the venue.

So, SISU aren't 'losing' £1m per season on naming rights - as the article insinuates - it's 'losing' closer to £250K. Which is approximately what they chose to pay David Bell a season.

If you're going to be so far out with income insinuations and claims, then you should also be the same factor out with the rent due; say's it's £200K and then it all appears okay. See?

korntony · Jul 11, 2013

Astute said:
One side has tried to sort things out. One side has tried everything they can NOT to sort things out. Most of us are saying what is presently happening. A few are still going on about what happened years ago.

We should look at what is happening now and hope it all works out for our club and fans. Not point score on the past. We know who the most truthful are out of them.

"One side" went back on a deal for SISU/CCFC to pay off the 14 million mortgage for a 50% stake and an extension of the lease on the stadium...

ACL and CCC have not denied this and this would have resolved all the issues and we would not be in this mess.

lordsummerisle · Jul 11, 2013

BackRoomRummermill said:
A very myopic article by the Sun , it is polarised to the extreme

Thank Christ we never have any of that around here!

covcity4life · Jul 11, 2013

Astute said:
An educated guess as religion was brought up in a football thread on the future of our club. Would put the odds at 95% of being correct.

i wasnt involved in that as far as i can remember????

p.s you would be 100% wrong on me being muslim

not that it should matter

James Smith · Jul 11, 2013

korntony said:
"One side" went back on a deal for SISU/CCFC to pay off the 14 million mortgage for a 50% stake and an extension of the lease on the stadium...

ACL and CCC have not denied this and this would have resolved all the issues and we would not be in this mess.

Nor has young Timothy proved his own claims and has yet to produce any proof to back them up. People have suggested that the reason why we have heard nothing from ACL is down to the impending legal action against them by SISU.

korntony · Jul 11, 2013

James Smith said:
Nor has young Timothy proved his own claim and has yet to produce any proof to back them up. People have suggested that the reason why we have heard nothing from ACL is down to the impending legal action against them by SISU.

I think the impending legal action is probably proof in itself..

Astute · Jul 11, 2013

covcity4life said:
a sun article that doesn't blame muslims for everything?

shocking

My eldest daughter is half Asian.......and a Muslim.

It don't make any difference to me either

Hugh Jarse · Jul 11, 2013

To all the c-units that have done this to my beloved club, I hope you get cancer and die!

covcity4life · Jul 11, 2013

Astute said:
My eldest daughter is half Asian.......and a Muslim.

It don't make any difference to me either

weird of you to bring such a thing up then!

James Smith · Jul 11, 2013

korntony said:
I think the impending legal action is probably proof in itself..

Of what? It's very easy to make claims if you don't have to back them up, something they will have to do if it reaches court. All having a court date means is that there will be a chance for evidence to be presented before a judge. It doesn't imply guilt and you have to be very careful not to prejudice a court case if you are in the media, because you can go to jail for contempt and get stuck with the costs of staging it again.

korntony · Jul 11, 2013

James Smith said:
Of what? It's very easy to make claims if you don't have to back them up, something they will have to do if it reaches court. All having a court date means is that there will be a chance for evidence to be presented before a judge. It doesn't imply guilt and you have to be very careful not to prejudice a court case if you are in the media, because you can go to jail for contempt and get stuck with the costs of staging it again.

do you not think it is possible that CCFC/SISU would be bound by the same rules as ACL prior to a court hearing.. and as you pointed out the chance for presenting evidence is in court.

This is the issue, everyone is so quick to discount a SISU claim or action with no evidence but an ACL/CCC claim is almost left alone

Mary_Mungo_Midge · Jul 11, 2013

korntony said:
do you not think it is possible that CCFC/SISU would be bound by the same rules as ACL prior to a court hearing.. and as you pointed out the chance for presenting evidence is in court.

This is the issue, everyone is so quick to discount a SISU claim or action with no evidence but an ACL/CCC claim is almost left alone

You've evidently forgotten the sanctity SISU affords court procedures:

http://www.skybluestalk.co.uk/threads/26927-Joy-Seppala-and-SISU-Honesty.

Nonleagueherewecome · Jul 11, 2013

korntony said:
do you not think it is possible that CCFC/SISU would be bound by the same rules as ACL prior to a court hearing.. and as you pointed out the chance for presenting evidence is in court.

This is the issue, everyone is so quick to discount a SISU claim or action with no evidence but an ACL/CCC claim is almost left alone

SISU have about as proven a record at lying since Lenny "The Spotless" Lying Leopard, record 18 times World Lying Champion.

Sky Blue Pete · Jul 11, 2013

korntony said:
do you not think it is possible that CCFC/SISU would be bound by the same rules as ACL prior to a court hearing.. and as you pointed out the chance for presenting evidence is in court.

This is the issue, everyone is so quick to discount a SISU claim or action with no evidence but an ACL/CCC claim is almost left alone

Again just not true - it is the contradictions from Fisher that wind people up and any comments/statements from ACL are challenged quite correctly by many

Astute · Jul 11, 2013

covcity4life said:
weird of you to bring such a thing up then!

Why?

I see everyone as an equal. So do most people these days. My daughter is 28 this year. It was a big thing when she was born. Over the years things have mellowed out. But comments going fully one way or the other don't help.

If it was meant as a joke I offer an apology. But if you are an Asian as I think you are you will understand how religious comments stand out to people that have had problems with this sort of thing in the past.

Mary_Mungo_Midge · Jul 11, 2013

korntony said:
do you not think it is possible that CCFC/SISU would be bound by the same rules as ACL prior to a court hearing.. and as you pointed out the chance for presenting evidence is in court.

This is the issue, everyone is so quick to discount a SISU claim or action with no evidence but an ACL/CCC claim is almost left alone

On another issue. Why would SISU present this 'evidence'? Are they really that bothered about the private/public interaction and how it may skew competitiveness? And why would they pursue this moral campaign at their cost?

They, as tenant, should have been happy that their landlord was more financially stable, as opposed to at the mercy of a bank. Why the angst?

The only logical conclusion has to be that ACL's demise was an issue they were contented by, and that their stability was a matter that they were upset by. Why would this be?

The only conclusion I can draw is that they were looking to capitalise from ACL's downfall.

Looking at today's announcement from Hoffman; their response seems to defy reason. Lest to starve ACL out of spite; or to serve the agenda above.

Can't you see it?

James Smith · Jul 11, 2013

korntony said:
do you not think it is possible that CCFC/SISU would be bound by the same rules as ACL prior to a court hearing.. and as you pointed out the chance for presenting evidence is in court.

This is the issue, everyone is so quick to discount a SISU claim or action with no evidence but an ACL/CCC claim is almost left alone

But SISU are the ones making the claims so unless they have the case held in camera (think that's the term) then the claims would be part of the case that they or their lawyers lodged with the court.

Evo1883 · Jul 11, 2013

SUN
Silly Uneducated Neanderthals

covcity4life · Jul 11, 2013

Astute said:
Why?

I see everyone as an equal. So do most people these days. My daughter is 28 this year. It was a big thing when she was born. Over the years things have mellowed out. But comments going fully one way or the other don't help.

If it was meant as a joke I offer an apology. But if you are an Asian as I think you are you will understand how religious comments stand out to people that have had problems with this sort of thing in the past.

you dont need to be asian to realise the sun is a scum racist newspaper, just read it.

its stuff like

islamic 8 man gang men terrorise dog for asian story

or 8 youths kick dog for white story

i dont mind if you disagree but its commonly known that it is a war mongering paper

p.s you need to stop guessing about my ethnicity haha

williesdonkeykick · Jul 11, 2013

shy_tall_knight said:
The new ground will not be in the city of Coventry. My monet is on Ryton or Baginton

You've got a monet? You could sell it and buy the club.

magic82ball · Jul 11, 2013

Grendel said:
So he is wrong when he says only Leeds in the football league pay more rent? Is he wrong when he says we are the only club who does not benefit from other revenue sources? Go on then everyone. Tell is which other clubs have a worse deal and instead of the usual diatribe just answer the question which council run grounds on a day to day basis offer a WORSE deal.

The addict thing is unsavoury but what he is trying to get at us that people who rent a massive superstore may feel they are the biggest retailer in town but when they read the small print they are only allowed the proceeds akin to a corner shop.

Fans believe the Ricoh is ours. Ok so if we were at our owned ground with an 18,000 capacity would we have had more revenue last season in that ground or the Ricoh?

It doesn't matter what ACL charged, could be £10 million pa for all I care, the rent is irrelevant.

It is universally agreed that as a business model, ACL rent was unsustainable for a Coventry team to ever flourish. This is not denied by anyone. The problem comes from SISU signing the rental agreement when it bought the club without negotiating a new rent before it signed to buy the club. It had the club and ACL at its mercy to negotiate a sensible deal but decided not to.

Now we find ourselves 6 years down the line with SISU pulling every dirty trick in the book to get the rent and other income streams to suit them, after the horse has bolted. It assumed maybe this would not be a problem as it would buy the Ricoh until ACL and Higgs Trust vetoed that when it discovered what snakes they were. And who can blame them when its a tax payers funded project. I think looking back and considering SISU distressing tactics on ACL, they were right in their judgement that they were snakes.

magic82ball · Jul 11, 2013

covcity4life said:
you dont need to be asian to realise the sun is a scum racist newspaper, just read it.

its stuff like

islamic 8 man gang men terrorise dog for asian story

or 8 youths kick dog for white story

i dont mind if you disagree but its commonly known that it is a war mongering paper

p.s you need to stop guessing about my ethnicity haha

Yep, definitely a Muslim.

Sky Blues · Jul 11, 2013

Look! A magical stadium fairy who can create stadiums at no cost to the sports clubs that use them.

Broken Hearted Sky Blue · Jul 11, 2013

Grendel said:
So you say all grounds equal. I ask again would last season under FPP would the club have been better off in a run down 18,000 capacity stadium or the Ricoh?

If they had bought it as they promised then the Ricoh or have you forgotten that? And what about next season if we play at Northampton? As for your original question how much would it have cost for a pint and a pie for 30000 students so they want the F ad B to give it away great

Astute · Jul 11, 2013

covcity4life said:
you dont need to be asian to realise the sun is a scum racist newspaper, just read it.

its stuff like

islamic 8 man gang men terrorise dog for asian story

or 8 youths kick dog for white story

i dont mind if you disagree but its commonly known that it is a war mongering paper

p.s you need to stop guessing about my ethnicity haha

But I am right though

I read all papers......they get me through long night shifts. The cheap red top papers are all the same. I could make a fair few comments on the subject but I won't. Not the place for it...which was my first point :facepalm:

Houchens Head · Jul 12, 2013

A Sun article? It MUST be true!!

theferret · Jul 12, 2013

I agree with much of what said in that article (in terms of the importance of profiting from a facility you own 365 days a year - instead of paying an extortionate amount to NOT profit from a facility 25 days a year), but surely the easiest way to make that a reality is for the club and stadium (that's the one that already exists) to be united under one owner. Seeing as there are people waiting in the wings who are prepared to make that a reality, surely the article should have been calling for SISU to step aside, cut their losses and admit they have failed. The fact that this point was not made does make you question the motives of the person writing it.

DazzleTommyDazzle · Jul 12, 2013

theferret said:
I agree with much of what said in that article (in terms of the importance of profiting from a facility you own 365 days a year - instead of paying an extortionate amount to NOT profit from a facility 25 days a year), but surely the easiest way to make that a reality is for the club and stadium (that's the one that already exists) to be united under one owner. Seeing as there are people waiting in the wings who are prepared to make that a reality, surely the article should have been calling for SISU to step aside, cut their losses and admit they have failed. The fact that this point was not made does make you question the motives of the person writing it.

Or the intelligence of the person writing it?

Diehard Si · Jul 12, 2013

I hate the Sun and I hate Sisu and I hate us going to Northampton .... But how many times have we as fans moaned that we shouldn't of left Highfield Road. The Ricoh just seems a bit soulless to me. Great when it's full but how often does that happen? It was a mistake.

DazzleTommyDazzle · Jul 12, 2013

Diehard Si said:
I hate the Sun and I hate Sisu and I hate us going to Northampton .... But how many times have we as fans moaned that we shouldn't of left Highfield Road. The Ricoh just seems a bit soulless to me. Great when it's full but how often does that happen? It was a mistake.

I tend to agree, but Highfield Road aint coming back and the Ricoh is so much better than Northampton.

theferret · Jul 12, 2013

DazzleTommyDazzle said:
Or the intelligence of the person writing it?

Quite possibly.

Tank Top · Jul 13, 2013

"Ah Bless" The Sun, and SISU in Bed together, they deserve each other..... a match made in Hell!

Big_Ben · Jul 13, 2013

theferret said:
Seeing as there are people waiting in the wings who are prepared to make that a reality, surely the article should have been calling for SISU to step aside, cut their losses and admit they have failed. The fact that this point was not made does make you question the motives of the person writing it.

But surely this is at the heart of the whole issue. SISU haven't reached the point of cutting their losses and leaving. They obviously (to me, anyway) still see a way of working their way out of the financial situation (which I believe is how they are looking at it - not at all as a football thing, but as a series of business transactions, a bit like the companies who are prepared to buy whole streets in order to get their hands on one particular property that they really want, then sell off the rest afterwards).
It's only a guess, but I would think that they are prepared to weather the hurricane of protest being kicked up by the fans because they have a plan that they believe will turn things round in the longer term, regardless of how unpopular that may be, and that will benefit SISU finances and investors first, but will also benefit the club as well as realistically, one can't succeed without the other. They also, between the mystifying myriad of companies, seem to be able to finance the plans (this isn't a cue to raise the point of not paying rent for the Ricoh - that argument has been done to death from a debating point of view) far beyond most of our experience and understanding.
I'm torn on this whole issue because if you can possibly stand back and take the emotion and passion out of it I can see some sense and to have some light at the end of the tunnel after years (decades) in the pitch darkness that's quite something. Then again, how can you really take the emotion and passion out of football fans?? That's where the word fan comes from - 'fanatics'.

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