Anonymity for the Accused? (1 Viewer)

Deleted member 5849 · Mar 13, 2023

Barrow men falsely accused of raping Eleanor Williams tell court they tried to kill themselves

Experiences told to sentencing hearing for woman convicted on nine counts of perverting course of justice

www.theguardian.com

This helps nobody. Obviously it's a harrowing tale for those falsely accused. But it also doesn't help those with genuine rape claims to come forward. So are we at a point where we need to keep the accused identities' anonymous until after a trial? But what do you do here, when she's accused them herself?!? The vigilanteism is chilling, and the ordeal is horrible.

And it also gives amunition to genuine rapists to intimidate victims, throw a bit of mud and all that.

Horrible. I hope the men get as much support as they possibly can. And her too, as she appears to be genuinely mentally ill.

Deleted member 5849 · Mar 13, 2023

Wouldn't keep Tommy RObinson anonymous mind you, the shit stirring shyster.

Deleted member 5849 · Mar 13, 2023

The other article about it is horrible too - how rumour and innuendo can destroy peoples' lives.

How Eleanor Williams’s lies about grooming and abuse unravelled

With one horrific viral post, a young woman set off a domino run that derailed lives, damaged community relations and created fear among the Asian community in BarrowWarning: graphic imagery

www.theguardian.com

clint van damme · Mar 13, 2023

Horrible story. Those fellas have been though hell.

TomRad85 · Mar 13, 2023

Deleted member 5849 said:
So are we at a point where we need to keep the accused identities' anonymous until after a trial?

The answer to this bit should be yes for all crimes, in my opinion.

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Deleted member 5849 · Mar 13, 2023

TomRad85 said:
The answer to this bit should be yes for all crimes, in my opinion.

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I tend to agree. What the hell do you do when the accuser splashes your name all over facebook, however?

I mean... if you *are* guilty, you can't try the victim really without it being in incredibly bad taste but, if they're innocent, you get.. this.

Sky Blue Pete · Mar 13, 2023

Don’t know why they couldn’t say she’d been charged

Deleted member 5849 · Mar 13, 2023

Sky Blue Pete said:
Don’t know why they couldn’t say she’d been charged

You read the article about the local reporter? Simon Gilbert never had it so good than working around here!

Barrow journalist hounded out of Cumbria for reporting court case

Amid a storm of rumours about grooming gangs, Amy Fenton receives scores of threats

www.theguardian.com

Sky Blue Pete · Mar 13, 2023

Deleted member 5849 said:
You read the article about the local reporter? Simon Gilbert never had it so good than working around here!

Barrow journalist hounded out of Cumbria for reporting court case

Amid a storm of rumours about grooming gangs, Amy Fenton receives scores of threats

www.theguardian.com

I did yep

SBT · Mar 13, 2023

It’s been tried a few times in the past 50 years but the law keeps going back and forth on it and there isn’t much evidence of it having much effect one way or the other. Rape charities say it would serve to reinforce the idea that rape cases are somehow more likely to involve false claims, which isn’t true - I have a lot of sympathy with that view.

Generally speaking I think there is value in justice taking place out in the open, but with the explosion of social media and citizen journalists etc then it might need to be revisited.

Deleted member 5849 · Mar 13, 2023

SBT said:
Rape charities say it would serve to reinforce the idea that rape cases are somehow more likely to involve false claims, which isn’t true - I have a lot of sympathy with that view.

Yeah, that's my difficulty - it's the obvious defence by dodgy men isn't it, that they were making it all up, and cases like this just fan the flames. I honestly don't know how to stop someone like this woman though, and the consequence of her actions is wider than just her and these particular men, isn't it.

Sky Blue Pete · Mar 13, 2023

Does anyone understand what the defence solicitor is saying at the end of the piece or is it just badly written

Eleanor Williams sentencing: Men tried to take own lives over rape lies

Eleanor Williams lied to police and posted on Facebook she had been trafficked by an Asian gang.

www.bbc.co.uk

Deleted member 5849 · Mar 13, 2023

Sky Blue Pete said:
Does anyone understand what the defence solicitor is saying at the end of the piece or is it just badly written

Eleanor Williams sentencing: Men tried to take own lives over rape lies

Eleanor Williams lied to police and posted on Facebook she had been trafficked by an Asian gang.

www.bbc.co.uk

Either: She still says they're guilty or;

She still says she's guilty because of the PTSD she suffers because of a childhood trauma.

(I guess!)

Edit: not the latter apparently, as the defence didn't use it in defence.

TomRad85 · Mar 13, 2023

Deleted member 5849 said:
I tend to agree. What the hell do you do when the accuser splashes your name all over facebook, however?

I mean... if you *are* guilty, you can't try the victim really without it being in incredibly bad taste but, if they're innocent, you get.. this.

Unsure, but lets start with the bit we agree on and let someone more clued up take it from there.

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David O'Day · Mar 13, 2023

Deleted member 5849 said:
Wouldn't keep Tommy RObinson anonymous mind you, the shit stirring shyster.

i notice her made it all about "muslim grooming gangs" when a number of the men she accused were white

Fat googley eyed Luton c**t

David O'Day · Mar 13, 2023

Deleted member 5849 said:
Either: She still says they're guilty or;

She still says she's guilty because of the PTSD she suffers because of a childhood trauma.

(I guess!)

Edit: not the latter apparently, as the defence didn't use it in defence.

Yeah, it's that despite all evidence showing she lied and made everything up she still carries on the act that it all really happened.

Is it a ruse to show she is mentally ill (or more so) or is she really that ill? I hope she gets hope and finds the peace she needs in life.

Deleted member 5849 · Mar 13, 2023

David O'Day said:
Yeah, it's that despite all evidence showing she lied and made everything up she still carries on the act that it all really happened.

Is it a ruse to show she is mentally ill (or more so) or is she really that ill? I hope she gets hope and finds the peace she needs in life.

It seems she might have beaten herself up!

David O'Day · Mar 13, 2023

Deleted member 5849 said:
It seems she might have beaten herself up!

Yep, definitely looks like this. At least the once in the case of the guy they proved was nowhere near the area when she claimed it happened.

Is Anonymity for defendants and proper punishment for those who break this online?

Deleted member 5849 · Mar 13, 2023

David O'Day said:
and proper punishment for those who break this online?

Where I struggle here is with somebody who has genuinely been advised, screams it out in the platforms available... to then prosecute them for breaking silence seems tough!

Obviously it doesn't in this particular case, but the same applies of innocent until proven guilty, and is unhelpful to say the least if a lynch mob decides the local reporter is part of a cover up for Muslim grooming gangs!

David O'Day · Mar 13, 2023

Deleted member 5849 said:
Where I struggle here is with somebody who has genuinely been advised, screams it out in the platforms available... to then prosecute them for breaking silence seems tough!

Obviously it doesn't in this particular case, but the same applies of innocent until proven guilty, and is unhelpful to say the least if a lynch mob decides the local reporter is part of a cover up for Muslim grooming gangs!

Why? Contempt of court is a crime now and you can see yourself in real trouble for talking about a case if it is deemed to have endangered the trial.

The law's are already there

Deleted member 5849 · Mar 13, 2023

David O'Day said:
Why? Contempt of court is a crime now and you can see yourself in real trouble for talking about a case if it is deemed to have endangered the trial.

The law's are already there

I guess I just see the reverse, Rochdale, and think it'd be salt in the wound if you then got a conviction for naming your abusers after being ignored.

But that then opens it up for this woman to cause so much shit!

David O'Day · Mar 13, 2023

Deleted member 5849 said:
I guess I just see the reverse, Rochdale, and think it'd be salt in the wound if you then got a conviction for naming your abusers after being ignored.

But that then opens it up for this woman to cause so much shit!

But naming the defendants doesn't help you get a conviction, in fact it is fuel for a mistrial appeal.

Deleted member 5849 · Mar 14, 2023

Deleted member 5849 said:
You read the article about the local reporter? Simon Gilbert never had it so good than working around here!

Barrow journalist hounded out of Cumbria for reporting court case

Amid a storm of rumours about grooming gangs, Amy Fenton receives scores of threats

www.theguardian.com

Must have been wild around there as at the same time this was happening, she was also being banned for drug driving!

Mail journalist banned from driving after admitting cocaine use - Journalism News from HoldtheFrontPage

Chief reporter was under influence behind the wheel

www.holdthefrontpage.co.uk

Things I take away from this however - I never realised there was a legal limit for cocaine in your system while driving a car(!)

Sky Blue Pete · Mar 14, 2023

Eleanor Williams jailed over false rape claims

The judge said Eleanor Williams' claims she was trafficked by an Asian gang were "complete fiction".

www.bbc.co.uk

She did not accept she was guilty wow

OffenhamSkyBlue · Mar 14, 2023

Eight years - good! Witch! She bought the hammer from B&Q then beat herself up with it

TomRad85 · Mar 14, 2023

OffenhamSkyBlue said:
Eight years - good! Witch! She bought the hammer from B&Q then beat herself up with it

Those IKEA wardrobes confuse me too tbf

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bringbackrattles · Mar 14, 2023

OffenhamSkyBlue said:
Eight years - good! Witch! She bought the hammer from B&Q then beat herself up with it

She'll be out after 4 years. Thought she'd have got longer.

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