ANDY THORN - Another Bobby Gould ??? (1 Viewer)

johnniericoh · Jul 15, 2012

Sceptics wondering who the two centre halves (William EDJENGUELE and Kevin MALAGA) are and what they can provide to CCFC can possibly be somewhat reassured by comparing AT to Bobby Gould in unearthing gems from out of nowhere.

At the end of the 82/83 season after Dave Sexton was sacked virtually the majority of the first team squad up and left CCFC (Danny Thomas, Gary Gillespie, Mark Hateley, Steve Hunt, Garry Thompson, Steve Whitton and others).

So in July 1983 Bobby Gould became Manager with a heck of a gap to fill before next seasons kickoff and he did the club proud.

Over that pre-season and the following year In came a variety of players some from the lower leagues some from non league, some out of sorts established players (Micky Gynne, Dave Bennett, Terry Gibson, Stuart Pearce, Trevor Peake, Brian Kilcline, Steve Ogrizovic etc)

As you can see the bulk of BG's squad went on to win the FA Cup with Pearce and Regis winning England caps.

So all I say is keep the faith with AT and his new charges if half as successful as BG's uncanny skill in the transfer market we have nothing to worry about.

PUSB

westcountry_skyblue · Jul 15, 2012

I damn well hope so JR we deserve a change in fortunes!!!

wolfie · Jul 15, 2012

I'm really pleased with AT he has stuck with the club even when things started to look desperate and is now building a team that could do us proud in div 1. If the players put in as much effort as he has we will walk the league.

Nonleagueherewecome · Jul 15, 2012

Another Gould? That's a bit cruel!

Grendel · Jul 15, 2012

Nonleagueherewecome said:
Another Gould? That's a bit cruel!

Yes even I prefer Thorn to Gould and I guess tha says it all.

SkyblueBazza · Jul 15, 2012

I hope you're right with the BG thing...after-all he did build a significant proportion of the '87 Cup winning squad & then went on to win it with Wimbledon.
I suspect AT has a quiet but steely determination to succeed here. Whether he has the capability remains to be seen...but I hope he does.
PUSB

Grendel · Jul 15, 2012

SkyblueBazza said:
I hope you're right with the BG thing...after-all he did build a significant proportion of the '87 Cup winning squad & then went on to win it with Wimbledon.
I suspect AT has a quiet but steely determination to succeed here. Whether he has the capability remains to be seen...but I hope he does.
PUSB

Gould was a clueless clown so in that respect I guess the OP has a point but at least thorn seems pleasant not a chip on each shoulder to balance him out.

SkyblueBazza · Jul 15, 2012

Grendel said:
Gould was a clueless clown so in that respect I guess the OP has a point but at least thorn seems pleasant not a chip on each shoulder to balance him out.

So clueless to bring in such gems that went on to win the cup...& then guide Wimbledon to victory too???
I wonder whether we expect too much sometimes? We have never been, are not now - & are never likely (short of being an obscenely rich-man's plaything) to be a consistent top 10 English club.

oldskyblue58 · Jul 15, 2012

not saying AT did or didnt find them because i just do not know or that he was or wasnt involved .... but I think Waggott is doing at least some of the finding and makes a big contribution to the process.... Waggott has a good reputation for doing this and it is part of the reason he is here .............. AT doesnt have so much time to go scouting nowadays

For me i think it is a joint effort between the two that varies in contribution

Not a negative or a dig at AT btw

Grendel · Jul 15, 2012

SkyblueBazza said:
So clueless to bring in such gems that went on to win the cup...& then guide Wimbledon to victory too???
I wonder whether we expect too much sometimes? We have never been, are not now - & are never likely (short of being an obscenely rich-man's plaything) to be a consistent top 10 English club.

The F A Cup thing is a two argument though isn't it? If he did sign them they were pretty hopeless when he was their manager. Also he didnt sign either fullback (or Brian Borrows who was a key player through the campaign or in fact Dean Emerson), he didnt sign Lloyd Mcgrath he inherited him nor Nick Pickering and most significantly Keith Houchen.

As for the notion he signed great talent it was a case of sign as many as you could and see what happens. Here is a team of Goulds discoveries from the first time around.

Avromovic

Stevens Platnaur Allardyce Spring

Barnes Jol Grimes

Latchford Withey Bamber

We would of gone down in his first season except for the most bizarre loan signing of all time and we were going down until he was axed the following Christmas.

blueflint · Jul 15, 2012

BG

Grendel said:
Gould was a clueless clown so in that respect I guess the OP has a point but at least thorn seems pleasant not a chip on each shoulder to balance him out.

dont know how old u are but bg knew a trick or two he proved that here and at wimbledon so dont slag him off he dont deserve it

Grendel · Jul 15, 2012

blueflint said:
dont know how old u are but bg knew a trick or two he proved that here and at wimbledon so dont slag him off he dont deserve it

I'm old enough to remember all of it. Can you remember him spending £200,000 on Ashley Grimes? I remember it well. I also remember being saved from relegation by Ferguson and he refusing him a new contract.

Sorry my view is that he was a liability evenl more so second time around.

kg82 · Jul 15, 2012

Grendel said:
The F A Cup thing is a two argument though isn't it? If he did sign them they were pretty hopeless when he was their manager. Also he didnt sign either fullback (or Brian Borrows who was a key player through the campaign or in fact Dean Emerson), he didnt sign Lloyd Mcgrath he inherited him nor Nick Pickering and most significantly Keith Houchen.

As for the notion he signed great talent it was a case of sign as many as you could and see what happens. Here is a team of Goulds discoveries from the first time around.

Avromovic

Stevens Platnaur Allardyce Spring

Barnes Jol Grimes

Latchford Withey Bamber

We would of gone down in his first season except for the most bizarre loan signing of all time and we were going down until he was axed the following Christmas.

Who was the most bizarre loan signing of all time?! I was only 1 or 2 at the time!

Grendel · Jul 15, 2012

kg82 said:
Who was the most bizarre loan signing of all time?! I was only 1 or 2 at the time!

It was bizarre in the sense it was allowed to happen. We loaned former goals scoring hero Mick Ferguson from Birmingham. We were losing games and heading down. Ferguson scored a couple of vital goals one I believe against Birmingham and 1 against Norwich.

The bizarre thing is we survived Birmingham went down and Gould having aside he would resign him ended up sending him back to Birmingham the club he had managed to help relegate.

SkyblueBazza · Jul 15, 2012

Well - that's sealed it for me...Thorn out - Grendel for manager.

Grendel · Jul 15, 2012

SkyblueBazza said:
Well - that's sealed it for me...Thorn out - Grendel for manager.

I couldn't take the pay cut.

johnniericoh · Jul 15, 2012

Nonleagueherewecome said:
Another Gould? That's a bit cruel!

Some posters a tad cruel here.

My prime accolade with BG is still his ability to unearth talent as per my OP and yes I admit there were shortfalls in his management career with us but don't forget he was recruiting to Division 1 (now Premiership) not Division 3 as of now and for us to hold our own that season including beating Liverpool 4-0, Arsenal 1-0 was truly a great achievement.

These players were unknown at the time but went on to become household names in their own right - so well done BG credit where it deserves.

PUSB

Grendel · Jul 15, 2012

johnniericoh said:
Some posters a tad cruel here.

My prime accolade with BG is still his ability to unearth talent as per my OP and yes I admit there were shortfalls in his management career with us but don't forget he was recruiting to Division 1 (now Premiership) not Division 3 as of now and for us to hold our own that season including beating Liverpool 4-0, Arsenal 1-0 was truly a great achievement.

These players were unknown at the time but went on to become household names in their own right - so well done BG credit where it deserves.

PUSB

I think we will just agree to disagree on this topic.

johnniericoh · Jul 15, 2012

Grendel said:
I think we will just agree to disagree on this topic.

Deal

PUSB

skybluelee · Jul 15, 2012

Grendel said:
The F A Cup thing is a two argument though isn't it? If he did sign them they were pretty hopeless when he was their manager. Also he didnt sign either fullback (or Brian Borrows who was a key player through the campaign or in fact Dean Emerson), he didnt sign Lloyd Mcgrath he inherited him nor Nick Pickering and most significantly Keith Houchen.

As for the notion he signed great talent it was a case of sign as many as you could and see what happens. Here is a team of Goulds discoveries from the first time around.

Avromovic

Stevens Platnaur Allardyce Spring

Barnes Jol Grimes

Latchford Withey Bamber

We would of gone down in his first season except for the most bizarre loan signing of all time and we were going down until he was axed the following Christmas.

But the fact is he DID sign Oggy, Peake, Killer, Gynn, Bennett and Cyrille, who between them formed more than 50% of the side that went on to achieve what no other side before or since has ever got close to doing. Add to that the fact that the above players played over 2,000 games for the club (yes, 2,000 games) they would still be remembered as legends regardless of the cup win.

Bobby did an awful lot of good for this club.

Jack Griffin · Jul 15, 2012

And whatever you think of his managerial abilities, he loves the club.

Grendel · Jul 15, 2012

skybluelee said:
But the fact is he DID sign Oggy, Peake, Killer, Gynn, Bennett and Cyrille, who between them formed more than 50% of the side that went on to achieve what no other side before or since has ever got close to doing. Add to that the fact that the above players played over 2,000 games for the club (yes, 2,000 games) they would still be remembered as legends regardless of the cup win.

Bobby did an awful lot of good for this club.

The other fact is that most of them were not effective under his stewardship. The most significant one being Regis. Have a look what he says about which Coventry manager he credits with a career renaissance - its not Gould.

Read who Stuart pierce thinks was the most volatile, erratic manager he ever had (it's not Brian clough) and read Peter Barnes story about Subbuteo.

John Sillett did a lot of good for this club. The word "legend" is now used for anyone associated with a club but he justifies the tag. Gould was more like a curse, a throwback to the land of the dinosaurs.

skybluelee · Jul 15, 2012

Grendel said:
The other fact is that most of them were not effective under his stewardship. The most significant one being Regis. Have a look what he says about which Coventry manager he credits with a career renaissance - its not Gould.

Read who Stuart pierce thinks was the most volatile, erratic manager he ever had (it's not Brian clough) and read Peter Barnes story about Subbuteo.

John Sillett did a lot of good for this club. The word "legend" is now used for anyone associated with a club but he justifies the tag. Gould was more like a curse, a throwback to the land of the dinosaurs.

Without Bobby Gould the club would now be in its 129th year without a major trophy. If only we could unearth some more 'curses' - perhaps that's the key. :thinking about:

Grendel · Jul 15, 2012

skybluelee said:
Without Bobby Gould the club would now be in its 129th year without a major trophy. If only we could unearth some more 'curses' - perhaps that's the key. :thinking about:

No it wouldn't. Shall we analyse his "second coming" while we are at it? Next you'll be telling me we should have been greatful for seeing John Gayle in Sky Blue.

Joe King · Jul 15, 2012

Grendel said:
Gould was a clueless clown so in that respect I guess the OP has a point but at least thorn seems pleasant not a chip on each shoulder to balance him out.

Can't agree with this at all.

skybluelee · Jul 15, 2012

Grendel said:
No it wouldn't. Shall we analyse his "second coming" while we are at it? Next you'll be telling me we should have been greatful for seeing John Gayle in Sky Blue.

Ok;

Liverpool 5-1
Villa 3-0
Arsenal (away) 3-0

Some of my happiest memories. Great days.

Joe King · Jul 15, 2012

Grendel said:
No it wouldn't. Shall we analyse his "second coming" while we are at it? Next you'll be telling me we should have been greatful for seeing John Gayle in Sky Blue.

And another thing........................

We should be grateful for seeing John Gayle in Sky Blue.

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