A comparison - Swansea & Ospreys (2 Viewers)

Mucca Mad Boys · Dec 11, 2012

cloughie said:
We are paying no rent
But according to you we should pay £ 1.2 million then less £ 1.03 million over the odds equals £197,00
So if that is going figure for a league 1 team, and you seem to change your 'facts' like the wind, the other day it was £150,00, to suit whatever you bluster on about, well only 1 subject really
As we have a better facility than any L1 team and have twice the amount of the average gate in L1 maybe be should pay pro rata and according to your figures ( on this day) that would be £394,000

We're paying no rent, ut we are contracted to pay 1.2.
1.03 is 1,030,000, so 1.2m - 1.03m = 170k! You idiot, 1.2m - 1.003 = 197k! You clearly didn't do well in maths, nor have a calculator nor know how to use one :jerkit: because of this calculation, your whole comment is now void
I put a ? By the 150k because I weren't 100% sure, I knew it was 150, 160 or 170k, I'm not changing the facts to suit my argument. Besides, I was out by 20k, wanna split hairs over it? Clearly you do, well, clearly you're a :jerkit:

And based on my facts, 240k is a fair amount, because (last season) when were in the championship, we were 15th in the average attendance league with c. 15k, BELOW AVERAGE, now we get average of c. 10k thus 240k should be max what we pay, I don't kow where the feck 394k came from. :facepalm: :thinking about:

Sorry, I might be 18, but you're clearly out of your depth.

Mucca Mad Boys · Dec 11, 2012

The CableGuy said:
And who's fault is that?

Oh yeah - SISU and the previous boards of CCFC.

... And the other owners... SISU are from exempt, but far from being the only party accountable for this mess.

cloughie · Dec 12, 2012

SkyBlue_Taylor said:
We're paying no rent, ut we are contracted to pay 1.2.
1.03 is 1,030,000, so 1.2m - 1.03m = 170k! You idiot, 1.2m - 1.003 = 197k! You clearly didn't do well in maths, nor have a calculator nor know how to use one :jerkit: because of this calculation, your whole comment is now void
I put a ? By the 150k because I weren't 100% sure, I knew it was 150, 160 or 170k, I'm not changing the facts to suit my argument. Besides, I was out by 20k, wanna split hairs over it? Clearly you do, well, clearly you're a :jerkit:
Yes i made a mistake , 170,000 it is and not 150,000 but it was late and some of us have had a hard day at work
And based on my facts, 240k is a fair amount, because (last season) when were in the championship, we were 15th in the average attendance league with c. 15k, BELOW AVERAGE, now we get average of c. 10k thus 240k should be max what we pay, I don't kow where the feck 394k came from. :facepalm: :thinking about:
We are not in the championship NOW, we are in L1, I know its difficult for you to get your head around and as you say based on your facts ,enough said
Sorry, I might be 18, but you're clearly out of your depth.

You are clearly struggling with your english I see as you have to resort to sign language

You big strong key board warrior

SkyBlueCharlie · Dec 12, 2012

SkyBlue_Taylor said:
You say I'm stupid to believe in SISU propaganda... A) I haven't spouted any SISU facts B) I'm comparing our rent to others.

Fact is, we pay 1.2m rent, or was that made up by SISU :thinking about: fact, Swansea don't pay rent, we pay 1.2m, fact, we pay just under half the rent THE RICHEST TEAM IN WORLD, fact, we pay more rent than most championship. Fact, we pay 960k more than average championship club's rent, fact, we pay 1.03m over L1.

All facts, no 'propaganda' here, this is where I have drawn my conclusions from. If only you put CCFC over ACL. But if CCFC cease to exist, good for you, I won't be happy that's for sure.

Of course you are spouting SISU propaganda...you keep quoting Fisher's 'average rent' figures as if they are the gospel truth. I've asked you before on another thread to prove that they are correct but you conveniently ignored that and just carried on preaching the gospel according to SISU. Either put up or shut up!

SkyBlueCharlie · Dec 12, 2012

O yes ....I forgot ....:jerkit:

Mucca Mad Boys · Dec 12, 2012

cloughie said:
You are clearly struggling with your english I see as you have to resort to sign language

You big strong key board warrior

You have got to be the biggest hypocrite here.

A) I worked yesterday, and had school, and fit in homework im between and after, I'm not moaning, nor making excuses, you tried to undermine me, but it backfired.

B) I'm well aware we're in L1, but I don't think L1 is fair on ACL, as it is likely we'll get promoted either this season or the next. You and others have said, we shouldn't pay average L1 rent, I agree with, and the RICOH is a prem facility, which I agree with, BUT, I think AVERAGE championship rent is fair (240k) because we came 15th in the attendance league last season and we get AVERAGE attendances in the championship, so based on that, we get above average attendances for L1, but AVERAGE championship rent, our rent SHOULD BE, BETWEEN 170k-240k. IS IT THAT HARD TO GRASP!? You, without realising, are helping MY argument (not yours) by dismissing the 'championship factor' - fail :facepalm:

C) my command of the English language is pretty good, actually. Or have you evidence to refute this. :jerkit:

I'll reiterate, you, are, out, of, your, depth! (Commas are there after each word so you read it 1 word at a time, ensuring you get the point).

Mucca Mad Boys · Dec 12, 2012

SkyBlueCharlie said:
Of course you are spouting SISU propaganda...you keep quoting Fisher's 'average rent' figures as if they are the gospel truth. I've asked you before on another thread to prove that they are correct but you conveniently ignored that and just carried on preaching the gospel according to SISU. Either put up or shut up!

Put up, or shut? Ok...

Hull, 5k rent, Ipswich, 30k (moved down from 115k), Swansea AND Ospreys, £0! All leagues above us, and more successful over past 5years.

Oh, and we're nearly pay (CCFC 1.28m, Man City 3m) 50% of the rent Man City do...

Show me this thread and I'll be MORE than happy to reply. I haven't seen it between work and school and homework.

For the record, I won't reply for a bit, because I'm going to work.

EDIT: furthermore, I haven't found every team's rent, because it's very time consuming, and I don't have time. If you can that'd be great, post them, I'll work out the average.

SkyBlueCharlie · Dec 12, 2012

SkyBlue_Taylor said:
Put up, or shut? Ok...

Hull, 5k rent, Ipswich, 30k (moved down from 115k), Swansea AND Ospreys, £0! All leagues above us, and more successful over past 5years.

Oh, and we're nearly pay (CCFC 1.28m, Man City 3m) 50% of the rent Man City do...

Show me this thread and I'll be MORE than happy to reply. I haven't seen it between work and school and homework.

For the record, I won't reply for a bit, because I'm going to work.

EDIT: furthermore, I haven't found every team's rent, because it's very time consuming, and I don't have time. If you can that'd be great, post them, I'll work out the average.

OK..all you do is quote three clubs, one in the premiership, two in the championship none of which are relevant to rents in League 1 (I notice that you very conveniently ignore the quoted figure for Walsall of £400K). What I'm looking for is validation of Mr Fishers stated average figue of £150k (or is it £160K or £170K you never appear to be quite sure) for League 1. Now I assume that you understand what an average is...it's all of the individual club rents (or mortage repayment) figures added together and then divided by the number of the clubs. You say that you don't have time to look at every clubs accounts because it's too time consuming, so if you can't be bothered to do it how do you know that the figures you are quoting are correct or even in the right ball park? I have looked at some of the accounts and decided that it was not possible for me to do (40+ years as a Management Accountant) so I believe the answer is that you can't either. You see I'm admitting that I can't do it so all I'm asking is that, as you obviously believe the figures to be correct, to show me how they are compiled. Easy isn't it?

Oh, and while I think about it I think you will find that Swansea do pay rent although it is a 'peppercorn' rent which might be a few pounds a year or might be a few thousands but I must admit that I haven't bothered too look at their accounts as they are in the Premiership and I'll worry about Premiership rents when we get there.

The other thread I mentioned is:
http://www.skybluestalk.co.uk/threads/23478-Why-ACL-s-rent-calculation-could-be-justified./page10 where I asked you the same question.

So are we clear now...how due you justify defending Mr Fisher's figures when you cannot prove that they are correct?

cloughie · Dec 12, 2012

SkyBlue_Taylor said:
my command of the English language is pretty good, actually. Or have you evidence to refute this. :jerkit:

I'll reiterate, you, are, out, of, your, depth! (Commas are there after each word so you read it 1 word at a time, ensuring you get the point).

Evidence think you have just given it with your usual sign language.

Out of my depth with you? hillarious, at least you have a high opinion of yourself.
Just to let you know I have been a director of a succesful company and I am now a director of another.
But still, I bet your mum loves you

Using commas now, wow are we supposed to be impressed?

You are a child like bore who I shall ignore from now on

Mucca Mad Boys · Dec 12, 2012

cloughie said:
Evidence think you have just given it with your usual sign language.

Out of my depth with you? hillarious, at least you have a high opinion of yourself.
Just to let you know I have been a director of a succesful company and I am now a director of another.
But still, I bet your mum loves you

Using commas now, wow are we supposed to be impressed?

You are a child like bore who I shall ignore from now on

So you'd rather we say "wanker"? Because that's better English :facepalm: or for you, fail. They're called emoticons, to show your emotions at a statement, would you say "happy" for a smile?

Over the Internet I can be a director of Apple... You might be a big shot on SBT, but behind your username, you could be a bum. (I'm not inferring either). What I will say, you don't act like a professional...

On English, you want to lecture me, but you haven't got a capital C In cloughie... Just pointing out. P.s I didn't have a problem, but, now you want to bring English language into it, I do now.

Tbh, Cloughie, you are a waste of time, you offer no evidence or constructive angles on debates, all you do is try to insult and undermine fellow posters. Such an adult (sarcasm).

Mucca Mad Boys · Dec 12, 2012

SkyBlueCharlie said:
OK..all you do is quote three clubs, one in the premiership, two in the championship none of which are relevant to rents in League 1 (I notice that you very conveniently ignore the quoted figure for Walsall of £400K). What I'm looking for is validation of Mr Fishers stated average figue of £150k (or is it £160K or £170K you never appear to be quite sure) for League 1. Now I assume that you understand what an average is...it's all of the individual club rents (or mortage repayment) figures added together and then divided by the number of the clubs. You say that you don't have time to look at every clubs accounts because it's too time consuming, so if you can't be bothered to do it how do you know that the figures you are quoting are correct or even in the right ball park? I have looked at some of the accounts and decided that it was not possible for me to do (40+ years as a Management Accountant) so I believe the answer is that you can't either. You see I'm admitting that I can't do it so all I'm asking is that, as you obviously believe the figures to be correct, to show me how they are compiled. Easy isn't it?

Oh, and while I think about it I think you will find that Swansea do pay rent although it is a 'peppercorn' rent which might be a few pounds a year or might be a few thousands but I must admit that I haven't bothered too look at their accounts as they are in the Premiership and I'll worry about Premiership rents when we get there.

The other thread I mentioned is:
http://www.skybluestalk.co.uk/threads/23478-Why-ACL-s-rent-calculation-could-be-justified./page10 where I asked you the same question.

So are we clear now...how due you justify defending Mr Fisher's figures when you cannot prove that they are correct?

Well, Donny pay 100k on their rent ( http://www.thebusinessdesk.com/yorkshire/news/352154-rovers-agree-keepmoat-lease-deal.html?news_section=7 )Colchester 300k and Walsall 470k the average is in this small sample is 290k, leaving MK dons (I cannot find their lease) and other clubs which I believe will bring down the rate to sub 200k. It is likely the facts are true.

To work it out, I need every club, with their leases, I don't have that, but I have that small sample, which might help.

I would reply to the other thread, but we're basically having the conversation on this thread. If you desperately want me to, I'll reply.

For the record, I would support Colchester and Walsall if they went renegade!

SkyBlue_Bear83 · Dec 12, 2012

It's surprising how passionate people get defending ACL and criticising the owners, if we could all channel that same amount of passion into supporting the club we would be better off for it

SkyBlueCharlie · Dec 13, 2012

SkyBlue_Taylor said:
To work it out, I need every club, with their leases, I don't have that, but I have that small sample, which might help.

That's exactly the problem, your sample is too small to be statistically acceptable and without a much larger sample you cannot use it to correlate an average. however if your samll sample is indicative, as you appear to think it is, then the result is already much higher than the figure being bandied about by SISU. The point I keep trying to get across is that no-one knows what the true figure is so should stop using it as fact.

Mucca Mad Boys · Dec 13, 2012

SkyBlueCharlie said:
That's exactly the problem, your sample is too small to be statistically acceptable and without a much larger sample you cannot use it to correlate an average. however if your samll sample is indicative, as you appear to think it is, then the result is already much higher than the figure being bandied about by SISU. The point I keep trying to get across is that no-one knows what the true figure is so should stop using it as fact.

I have 2 more teams, the average is now 213k

(Stevenage, Bournemouth, Colchester, Walsall, Donny)

I know Crawley lease their stadium, but couldn't find a figure. I think MK Dons lease n all.

Mucca Mad Boys · Dec 13, 2012

SkyBlueCharlie said:
That's exactly the problem, your sample is too small to be statistically acceptable and without a much larger sample you cannot use it to correlate an average. however if your samll sample is indicative, as you appear to think it is, then the result is already much higher than the figure being bandied about by SISU. The point I keep trying to get across is that no-one knows what the true figure is so should stop using it as fact.

A larger sample? The sample is no more than 9 teams max, most teams in L1 own their ground, we have to find the teams who rent and how much.

I'm sorry, but I doubt Fisher would give a blatantly false fact. I'm not saying I trust him (I wouldn't trust anyone in that position), just if the facts said otherwise, it'd be humiliating and would also give ACL a lot of leverage in negotiations.

SkyBlueCharlie · Dec 13, 2012

SkyBlue_Taylor said:
I'm sorry, but I doubt Fisher would give a blatantly false fact. I'm not saying I trust him (I wouldn't trust anyone in that position), just if the facts said otherwise, it'd be humiliating and would also give ACL a lot of leverage in negotiations.

Mortgage payments equate to rents so you need those as well.

If no-one can find the true figures then what has Fisher got to worry about?

I'm now bored with repeating myself so that's enough on this... let's just say we agree to disagree but I admire your persistence and if you find the answer I'd like to know....good luck in the future and I hope school goes well. (Genuine comment not sarcasm or anything else).

Mucca Mad Boys · Dec 13, 2012

SkyBlueCharlie said:
Mortgage payments equate to rents so you need those as well.

If no-one can find the true figures then what has Fisher got to worry about?

I'm now bored with repeating myself so that's enough on this... let's just say we agree to disagree but I admire your persistence and if you find the answer I'd like to know....good luck in the future and I hope school goes well. (Genuine comment not sarcasm or anything else).

I appreciate, the figures I have at the min is an average of 213k, and tbh, I can't be bothered anymore, I know there're are others out there, but I don't care anymore.

The bottom line, for me, in this argument, is, I want the best deal CCFC can get, no SISU agenda, no ACL agenda, a CCFC agenda. I can't see how getting a low rent is bad for CCFC.

This is what I don't get with some fans.

A comparison - Swansea & Ospreys (2 Viewers)

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A comparison - Swansea & Ospreys (2 Viewers)

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