Embarrassing (21 Viewers)

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PVA

Well-Known Member
SHUNT31 said:
It’s also fact that immigrants commit more crime per capita. You can’t pick and choose the facts you use. There has to be a balance, no?
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It's not a fact. The opposite is true.
 
D

DT-R

Well-Known Member
Nick said:
I wouldn't use it for either personally.

However, LGBTQ is a group of actual people isn't it? Same as there's "London Fans" and "Disabled Fans".

The equivalent would be "Left wing ccfc supporters group" and "right wing supports group".
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Question is though, is Hadji Wright better with the left wing or in the centre?

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Senior Vick from Alicante

Senior Vick from Alicante

Well-Known Member
duffer said:
The sticker is racist, because it openly supports Rupert Lowe, who is a racist. He espouses views that are quite clearly racist. Not political, racist, and not particularly well hidden (see link below).

This stuff he shouts about goes a long, long way beyond a polite discussion on immigration control. Is that the sort of person you want to see our club associated with?

skwawkbox.org

The ugly inside: Rupert Lowe and the Reform civil war

‘Spot the link between fascism and football’ – Rupert Lowe and a local football fanzine front page from his time as Southampton FC chair. This guest article was written by Resista…
skwawkbox.org skwawkbox.org
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You can be sued for this statement be careful.
 
torchomatic

torchomatic

Well-Known Member
Nick said:
Again, did anybody see who was actually handing them out?
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Yeah, and as I said earlier, if they are a member on here it would be interesting to hear the rationale behind it all.
 
biggymania

biggymania

Well-Known Member
DT-R said:
But again, using the CCFC badge in LGBTQ+ things is ok? It's ok for one, but not the other?
Whether you agree or dont agree, you can't pick and choose. Youre either for politics in football, or against. There's no inbetween.

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I understand this point of view but I think it's overly simplistic. The campaigns the club has done for marginalised communities are about inclusiveness, aren't they? Making people feel safe and welcome at the club.

"STOP THE BOATS" is not that, quite the opposite.
 
P

PVA

Well-Known Member
SHUNT31 said:
Just seen your other post, not going to go through an off topic thread to find it.

How is the opposite true?
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If you only count foreign nationals it is true. If you include foreign born (ie all immigrants) it is not true.
 
torchomatic

torchomatic

Well-Known Member
DT-R said:
The white bloke is in prison, and i can say as a matter of fact, if he were released and kept in a local hotel, the staff there wouldn't keep it underwraps like the asylum seekers. They'd shout to the press. And within hours there'd be people outside saying for blood. Fact.

But what are they to protest about? Stop people having children all together because a small % of all children born will grow up to be kiddy fiddlers? Be realistic. People are on paedophile, regardless of skin colour. To say otherwise is fucking ridiculous and you know it.

Stopping the boats is a genuine concern to a genuine threat. Stopping ALL birth isnt. You can't stop British born people becoming nonce's, you can stop foreign born ones entering though by stopping boats and only allowing people though legit routes with genuine background checks.

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So really it has nothing to do with the protection of children, but just stopping certain people coming here?
 
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Nick

Nick

Administrator
Why would the word "Boats" be blurred out? I fully get it if it was something worse but not sure how "Stop the Boats" needs to be blurred out. Unless of course somebody had a boating accident and it might trigger them.
 
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nunchuckas

Well-Known Member
torchomatic said:
Same with the MAGA crowd. Farage, Trump and Yaxley-Lennon love the uneducated. Makes their job a whole lot easier.
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It's exactly why the previous few right wing Governments have put less emphasis on people going into higher education, as it was 'spiralling out of control' and we were at risk of having an, ever increasingly, educated society (and not divided and conquered, like Britain bloody well oughta be).

I study voting demographics quite a lot, and it's pretty much the only demographic and stereotype that still holds true in the UK. The old fashioned upper/lower class one is dead, a middle or upper-class educated person is less likely to vote far right than a working class uneducated person, now.

And even the age one, isn't quite as clear cut. As that still is a by-product of the level of education. We haven't, yet, got a reasonable representation across the elder age demographics of people who have received higher education (through no fault of their own). As it's only really those who are now around mid 40s or lower where education has been more accessible. And it's the 40s demographic that is now the most interesting, as this is around the age where historically people would shift further to right, politically. But this no longer happening at the same rate, due to education levels. Will be interesting what will happen in 20+ years times when we have a good representation of educated 50, 60, 70 year olds...
 
SHUNT31

SHUNT31

Well-Known Member
PVA said:
If you only count foreign nationals it is true. If you include foreign born (ie all immigrants) it is not true.
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My statistics are correct though.

Foreign nationals make up 9% of the population but commit 16.1% of crime. Nothing to do with foreign born.

Considering foreign nationals include refugees, migrants and asylum seekers, it’s completely relevant. The person in Nuneaton was a migrant.
 
Senior Vick from Alicante

Senior Vick from Alicante

Well-Known Member
torchomatic said:
And their "outrage" is always very selective. The good folk of Nuneaton were out a few weeks ago protesting about that girl getting raped by asylum seekers. Literally the following week, the police stated they had arrested and charged a white guy from Nuneaton who had been abusing kids for years and...s
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nunchuckas said:
Granted it's only my own anecdotal evidence, but near enough every single comment or clip of people who support Reform, or stop the boats, etc. is, well, barely in English.

Also, at the last election, the largest demographic that had the greatest propensity to vote for Reform (even more than age!), was the uneducated.
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That's a very assumptive statement around propensity. The folk that voted just might think that the old established party's in this country have let them down so have decided to try something else. White British boys are statistically supposed to have the worst outcomes so could choose others to vote for based on the fact that Labour are not what they were in years gone by and the Tories are a failed Government. Statistics can be made to fit around any assumption.
 
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nunchuckas

Well-Known Member
SHUNT31 said:
I’m not disputing the demographics but I think it’s unfair to label someone who has different views on political matters as thick. Their opinions are just a valid as yours, regardless of how much you may disagree with them.
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Well...the demographics do indicate, that on the balance of probabilities, they are more likely to be thick.

I understand your point that every opinion and vote has equal weighting, regardless of how well researched they are. And I don't automatically label everyone with different political views to me as thick. But if they can't at least articulate what their opinion is, it's hard to have any respect for said opinion.

I have wasted far too much time trying to reason, and play devil's advocate with many people with far right views; to at least see their side of the argument. But, unfortunately, they've all just been propagandised, don't really understand what or how they want to achieve, just repeat the rhetoric of their idols.
And even their idols, they haven't put forward even a token manifesto, or any actual policies, or used any reputable economic evidence. Because they don't even need to, their demographic will lap it up, regardless. It's actually quite sad that these people are being exploited, by having their fears triggered and played up to by their heroes and the media.
 
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covcity4life

covcity4life

Well-Known Member
Ok so if no racist word the main issue is the badge on there. Leave ccfc out of it

I agree with @Earlsdon_Skyblue1 there is clearly a conversation to be had if it's possible to do it without getting angry at each other, but leave the football out of it I say.
 
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nunchuckas

Well-Known Member
Senior Vick from Alicante said:
That's a very assumptive statement around propensity. The folk that voted just might think that the old established party's in this country have let them down so have decided to try something else. White British boys are statistically supposed to have the worst outcomes so could choose others to vote for based on the fact that Labour are not what they were in years gone by and the Tories are a failed Government. Statistics can be made to fit around any assumption.
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You're right to be wary of statistics, they certainly can be manipulated to tell a story and push an agenda. And it's impossible to know the reasons for individual cases about why they voted a particular way, trends can be useful, but won't pick up the reasons behind protest votes, for sure.

Which is why it's important for people to have critical thinking skills to interpret the information themselves, rather than through a tabloid headline or social media slogan.

The particular demographic I shared, is the clearest demographic swing we have, and form your own opinion, but I think it's especially telling if you look at what highly educated people are not voting for.
 
SHUNT31

SHUNT31

Well-Known Member
Sky Blue Goblin said:
Curiously what are the stats if you include foreign born?
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Much closer aligned to the population albeit still slightly higher.

The problem is, the foreign born include people that have moved to this country years ago from places such as Eastern Europe. 60/70’s included a lot of Asians and Caribbean’s who have integrated well into society.

The people arriving today are from places like Afghanistan, Albania, Syria etc and statistically the crime numbers for these countries is shocking. I don’t know the % of people that arrive that receive indefinite leave to remain or eventually become citizens but I would guess the crime rate % of foreign born will increase over the next years. That may be uncomfortable for some.
 
rob9872

rob9872

Well-Known Member
nunchuckas said:
It's exactly why the previous few right wing Governments have put less emphasis on people going into higher education, as it was 'spiralling out of control' and we were at risk of having an, ever increasingly, educated society (and not divided and conquered, like Britain bloody well oughta be).

I study voting demographics quite a lot, and it's pretty much the only demographic and stereotype that still holds true in the UK. The old fashioned upper/lower class one is dead, a middle or upper-class educated person is less likely to vote far right than a working class uneducated person, now.

And even the age one, isn't quite as clear cut. As that still is a by-product of the level of education. We haven't, yet, got a reasonable representation across the elder age demographics of people who have received higher education (through no fault of their own). As it's only really those who are now around mid 40s or lower where education has been more accessible. And it's the 40s demographic that is now the most interesting, as this is around the age where historically people would shift further to right, politically. But this no longer happening at the same rate, due to education levels. Will be interesting what will happen in 20+ years times when we have a good representation of educated 50, 60, 70 year olds...
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Can we please stop labelling Reform voters as far right? Whilst lots of opinions will be an agenda pushed by some of them, these aren't NF or Britain First etc. I know lots of people who are consistently fed up with main stream political parties and are considering them. That's a concern because they're pretty much a one trick pony and don't yet have the gravitas or ideas to even form a sensible opposition, but such labels aren't helpful and will push people towards them.
 
biggymania

biggymania

Well-Known Member
chiefdave said:
www.bbc.co.uk

Shifty

When power begins to shift in society, everything becomes unstable, exciting and frightening. Living in Britain at the end of the 20th century. From acclaimed film maker Adam Curtis.
www.bbc.co.uk www.bbc.co.uk
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Yeah, Coventry did not get a good run out in that doc.

More broadly, I can imagine poverty has a lot to do with this issue. Successive governments aren't doing enough to address poverty in the population and now the far-right has done a terrific job appealing to the poor white demographic. It's the same playbook being repeated (with significant success) in many countries.

That this is happening here and boiling over into Coventry City shouldn't be a surprise when you consider the demographics within our fanbase. There is definitely room for a more reasonable debate but unfortunately there aren't many people on either side of it capable of entering that in good faith and listening to each other.
 
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