Coronavirus Thread (Off Topic, Politics) (7 Viewers)

hill83 said:

For the above. Surely they are fully expecting the virus to hit as soon as tourists are allowed there?

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And this is my own personal quandary and why I won’t be flying anywhere anytime soon.

Imagine being, unwittingly, responsible for reinfecting a place that had worked so hard to get rid of the virus just because you want a cheap pint and a bit of sun?

hill83 said:

For the above. Surely they are fully expecting the virus to hit as soon as tourists are allowed there?

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They are doing lots of checks, we have had 2 flights from Madrid with people with the virus, before they got of the plane they were waiting for them (track and trace when it works). With general tourism we know some will slip through, your relying on people being honest but that is why the hard line on masks etc.
People say they won't come till next year for various reasons, good luck as next year most businesses i've spoken to say if no tourists in the next few months then they won't be here next year. So make sure your all inclusive as that's all you will have. They just released a list today of all the people accepted for rental help, NOT ONE down south where the tourists go and the brits live. Bear in mind this was for all the Canary islands 232 accepted, it's bull shit.
If you like it here and want a holiday come now (more than ever), as next year most of us won't be here for you any more. As for the second round mentioned on the pdf, it won't happen as they have already said the pot is dry, only those already getting help will get any more.

LastGarrison said:

And this is my own personal quandary and why I won’t be flying anywhere anytime soon.

Imagine being, unwittingly, responsible for reinfecting a place that had worked so hard to get rid of the virus just because you want a cheap pint and a bit of sun?

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I get that, but to be honest if you think your clear we NEED you. Without you tourists most places won't be here next year so you will have the beach and your hotel and the few places that survive charging you a fortune for a beer or food.

imagine if we were governed by people with principles

Coronavirus: New Zealand's health minister resigns after series of COVID-19 lockdown blunders

Sky Blue Pete said:

Fran e almost 1000
Spain increasing
Germany over 400

I’m sure saddle and Dom can sort this out with a supply of Johnson’s optimism

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Im not even a tory. Explained before, there is good news and scientific progress, but this board wants to just focus on the daily mail scaremongering.

At the end of the day, even countries who had hard lockdowns, eg Australia are still getting cases. This isn't going away. We have to find a way to carry on with life best we can and live with it. Otherwise we're fucked for decades not just a year or 2

Saddlebrains said:

Im not even a tory. Explained before, there is good news and scientific progress, but this board wants to just focus on the daily mail scaremongering.

At the end of the day, even countries who had hard lockdowns, eg Australia are still getting cases. This isn't going away. We have to find a way to carry on with life best we can and live with it. Otherwise we're fucked for decades not just a year or 2

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Australia has had 8,000 cases and just over 100 deaths.
I'm not sure why you keep comparing us to countries who have handled this successfully.
Finding a way to carry on when you've had just over 100 deaths is a different proposition to when you've had over 40,000.

pipkin73 said:

I get that, but to be honest if you think your clear we NEED you. Without you tourists most places won't be here next year so you will have the beach and your hotel and the few places that survive charging you a fortune for a beer or food.

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We rebooked going to Greece for August. Have played by the rules for months and if their authorities are willing to let Brits in then we’ll go and conform with whatever regulations are in place at the time.

clint van damme said:

Australia has had 8,000 cases and just over 100 deaths.
I'm not sure why you keep comparing us to countries who have handled this successfully.
Finding a way to carry on when you've had just over 100 deaths is a different proposition to when you've had over 40,000.

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Is this going away, wherever you are in the world yes or no? The government have fucked it up. Its done, its happened. Now we either cower at home and completely bankrupt the country (if it isnt already) or we crack on best we can, maintain social distancing, protect the vulnerable etc.

Its been a clusterfuck. But it's what it is now. Moaning about how much Boris and co have got this wrong isnt going to get rid of the virus is it?

We will have to live with this virus the world over. Thats a fact. Its how we do that whilst saving as many lives as possible, but also not allowing the country to completely crash and burn. Its down to people to deal with this properly, not the plebs on government

clint van damme said:

imagine if we were governed by people with principles

Coronavirus: New Zealand's health minister resigns after series of COVID-19 lockdown blunders

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Collectively we’d have to have the common sense to vote them in in the first place. I’m not optimistic.

Saddlebrains said:

Is this going away, wherever you are in the world yes or no? The government have fucked it up. Its done, its happened. Now we either cower at home and completely bankrupt the country (if it isnt already) or we crack on best we can, maintain social distancing, protect the vulnerable etc.

Its been a clusterfuck. But it's what it is now. Moaning about how much Boris and co have got this wrong isnt going to get rid of the virus is it?

We will have to live with this virus the world over. Thats a fact. Its how we do that whilst saving as many lives as possible, but also not allowing the country to completely crash and burn. Its down to people to deal with this properly, not the plebs on government

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We do - but countries are living with this when they have minimal infections and no deaths. We are trying to live with it when we have 100 deaths a day. Does that not ring enormous alarm bells??

Saddlebrains said:

. Its done, its happened. Now we either cower at home and completely bankrupt the country (if it isnt already) or we crack on best we can, maintain social distancing, protect the vulnerable etc

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Well shielding is removed, and those people will be expected to go to work as normal...

The point is if we get this wrong by releasing too early, the economic consequences further down the line could be far worse.

Cower at home is a trite emotive cruel phrase, only befitting of Dom

Saddlebrains said:

Is this going away, wherever you are in the world yes or no? The government have fucked it up. Its done, its happened. Now we either cower at home and completely bankrupt the country (if it isnt already) or we crack on best we can, maintain social distancing, protect the vulnerable etc.

Its been a clusterfuck. But it's what it is now. Moaning about how much Boris and co have got this wrong isnt going to get rid of the virus is it?

We will have to live with this virus the world over. Thats a fact. Its how we do that whilst saving as many lives as possible, but also not allowing the country to completely crash and burn. Its down to people to deal with this properly, not the plebs on government

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you're wrong, it is down to to government.
Look an the example of a country that's handled it well, New Zealand, health minister breaks lock down, he resigns. What happens here?
Pubs opening tomorrow, a political decision, taken when we were at level 4, not 3 or transitioning between the two. Madness.
I really feel that this is going to escalate now the pubs are open, I hope I'm wrong, but if it does do you not think that's going to have an adverse affect on the economy and the NHS?

Ian1779 said:

We do - but countries are living with this when they have minimal infections and no deaths. We are trying to live with it when we have 100 deaths a day. Does that not ring enormous alarm bells??

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Well this has been done to death about how many deaths a day are there. I posted myself a while back regarding a friends grandmother who was down as covid with no test but had terminal lung cancer. Just another 'statistic' ( btw that death certificate has now been changed to cancer) .

I see everyones point. A lot of what is said is hard to argue with. But again, until im blue in the face, do not believe everything written


For example there are zero Covid patients in UHCW. 0. NIL. Square root of fuck all.


But thats not been in the telegraph. Not been on social media. Because it doesnt sell or worry the masses. I know im sounding like a hippy here and im far from it, just wish people could balance it out.

It's been a shit few months. But we seem to be, rightly or wrongly, getting back on track.

clint van damme said:

you're wrong, it is down to to government.
Look an the example of a country that's handled it well, New Zealand, health minister breaks lock down, he resigns. What happens here?
Pubs opening tomorrow, a political decision, taken when we were at level 4, not 3 or transitioning between the two. Madness.
I really feel that this is going to escalate now the pubs are open, I hope I'm wrong, but if it does do you not think that's going to have an adverse affect on the economy and the NHS?

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I agree to an extent. I do feel its too early. But what im getting at is what we gonna do about it? You would think people would stay in ( i will be) but it just wont happen. This is the kind of thing i mean by the government ballsing up and us doing what we can.

But on the flipside of this, we're seeing this thing peter out into a timid version of what it was. This is what people have to balance

Saddlebrains said:

Well this has been done to death about how many deaths a day are there. I posted myself a while back regarding a friends grandmother who was down as covid with no test but had terminal lung cancer. Just another 'statistic' ( btw that death certificate has now been changed to cancer) .

I see everyones point. A lot of what is said is hard to argue with. But again, until im blue in the face, do not believe everything written


For example there are zero Covid patients in UHCW. 0. NIL. Square root of fuck all.


But thats not been in the telegraph. Not been on social media. Because it doesnt sell or worry the masses. I know im sounding like a hippy here and im far from it, just wish people could balance it out.

It's been a shit few months. But we seem to be, rightly or wrongly, getting back on track.

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I've heard examples like the one you've given and I've also heard examples of it happening the other way round where someone with an underlying illness has had that put down as the cause of death when they had covid so I think it works both ways but we will probably never get a truly accurate picture. I think it's fair to say that we are one of the worse performing countries though and we should be doing everything not to exacerbate that which I don't think we are.

Saddlebrains said:

I agree to an extent. I do feel its too early. But what im getting at is what we gonna do about it? You would think people would stay in ( i will be) but it just wont happen. This is the kind of thing i mean by the government ballsing up and us doing what we can.

But on the flipside of this, we're seeing this thing peter out into a timid version of what it was. This is what people have to balance

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I still think we should have jst held off with the pubs for a couple more weeks especially since things seem to have plateaued slightly recently but as I said in another post, this decision was taken weeks ago, it has nothing to do with numbers or science.

Saddlebrains said:

I agree to an extent. I do feel its too early. But what im getting at is what we gonna do about it? You would think people would stay in ( i will be) but it just wont happen. This is the kind of thing i mean by the government ballsing up and us doing what we can.

But on the flipside of this, we're seeing this thing peter out into a timid version of what it was. This is what people have to balance

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When a teacher doesn’t make much effort to enforce rules the good kids will try and comply anyway, the bad ones will run riot and those in between will eventually drift off. In the end even the good ones go ‘sod it’

Saddlebrains said:

I agree to an extent. I do feel its too early. But what im getting at is what we gonna do about it? You would think people would stay in ( i will be) but it just wont happen. This is the kind of thing i mean by the government ballsing up and us doing what we can.

But on the flipside of this, we're seeing this thing peter out into a timid version of what it was. This is what people have to balance

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What makes you say it petering out?

shmmeee said:

What makes you say it petering out?

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Numerous doctors across Europe, and the UK saying patients that present to hospitals having much milder symptoms, e.g not needing to be put into ITU instantly, or being hypoxic with dangerously low oxygen levels. One Italian doctor who was in ground zero in Lombardy during March called it something like going from a lion to a pussycat. Something along them lines, but will try and find the link

Saddlebrains said:

Numerous doctors across Europe, and the UK saying patients that present to hospitals having much milder symptoms, e.g not needing to be put into ITU instantly, or being hypoxic with dangerously low oxygen levels. One Italian doctor who was in ground zero in Lombardy during March called it something like going from a lion to a pussycat. Something along them lines, but will try and find the link

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Cheers. My concern is from what I’ve read that it’s about viral load when you catch it and we’ve just reduced the viral load with lockdown measures but it’s there ready to flare up again. I’ve seen no evidence of mutation to a new strain that’s less dangerous for example. Of course medical knowledge isn’t static and we should be able to treat much better now.

shmmeee said:

Cheers. My concern is from what I’ve read that it’s about viral load when you catch it and we’ve just reduced the viral load with lockdown measures but it’s there ready to flare up again. I’ve seen no evidence of mutation to a new strain that’s less dangerous for example. Of course medical knowledge isn’t static and we should be able to treat much better now.

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I agree, viral load seems to be a major factor on how it affects people. Im massively concerned this whole thing could flare up again, i would be lying if i didnt. I just like to push the side of things that seem to be a bit better news to balance things out if that makes sense?

More could have Covid immunity than tests suggest


Covid-19 immunity could be twice as high as believed, Swedish study finds


No antibodies? You could still have had Covid by fighting it off with T-cells

Do Lockdowns Work? Mounting Evidence Says No | Ryan McMaken

Coronavirus is ‘weakening’ and virus will die out Italian expert says



Here are some links if anyone would like to read. Again, not saying this is all over etc, but as i say, there is more to this than gets reported. There is progress out there, and there are chances it could die out, a few experts saying its following SARS very closely.

But these kind of articles do help me, hopefullt could help others realise its not just horrendous news

Am I right in thinking the antibody test can definitely tell you that you've had it but it can't necessarily tell you that you definitely haven't? My sister was randomly selected by her GP to have one and it came back negative but 99.9% sure she had it in March.

ajsccfc said:

Am I right in thinking the antibody test can definitely tell you that you've had it but it can't necessarily tell you that you definitely haven't? My sister was randomly selected by her GP to have one and it came back negative but 99.9% sure she had it in March.

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There is still uncertainty about how long the antibodies remain in your body.

ajsccfc said:

Am I right in thinking the antibody test can definitely tell you that you've had it but it can't necessarily tell you that you definitely haven't? My sister was randomly selected by her GP to have one and it came back negative but 99.9% sure she had it in March.

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Seems to be some research coming out of china showing immunity only lasts 3-5 months which is shit

Saddlebrains said:

Is this going away, wherever you are in the world yes or no? The government have fucked it up. Its done, its happened. Now we either cower at home and completely bankrupt the country (if it isnt already) or we crack on best we can, maintain social distancing, protect the vulnerable etc.

Its been a clusterfuck. But it's what it is now. Moaning about how much Boris and co have got this wrong isnt going to get rid of the virus is it?

We will have to live with this virus the world over. Thats a fact. Its how we do that whilst saving as many lives as possible, but also not allowing the country to completely crash and burn. Its down to people to deal with this properly, not the plebs on government

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Explain to me how a sovereign currency issuer can go bankrupt.

fernandopartridge said:

Explain to me how a sovereign currency issuer can go bankrupt.

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Love an argument you do dont you, id hate to see your blood pressure. Chill

Saddlebrains said:

Well this has been done to death about how many deaths a day are there. I posted myself a while back regarding a friends grandmother who was down as covid with no test but had terminal lung cancer. Just another 'statistic' ( btw that death certificate has now been changed to cancer) .

I see everyones point. A lot of what is said is hard to argue with. But again, until im blue in the face, do not believe everything written


For example there are zero Covid patients in UHCW. 0. NIL. Square root of fuck all.


But thats not been in the telegraph. Not been on social media. Because it doesnt sell or worry the masses. I know im sounding like a hippy here and im far from it, just wish people could balance it out.

It's been a shit few months. But we seem to be, rightly or wrongly, getting back on track.

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I really don’t think that’s accurate saddle. So unlikely to be nil cases with positive test

Saddlebrains said:

Well this has been done to death about how many deaths a day are there. I posted myself a while back regarding a friends grandmother who was down as covid with no test but had terminal lung cancer. Just another 'statistic' ( btw that death certificate has now been changed to cancer) .

I see everyones point. A lot of what is said is hard to argue with. But again, until im blue in the face, do not believe everything written


For example there are zero Covid patients in UHCW. 0. NIL. Square root of fuck all.


But thats not been in the telegraph. Not been on social media. Because it doesnt sell or worry the masses. I know im sounding like a hippy here and im far from it, just wish people could balance it out.

It's been a shit few months. But we seem to be, rightly or wrongly, getting back on track.

Click to expand...

The reported COVID deaths 43k currently, are those with a positive test.

There are an addition 11k or so where COVID is mentioned on the death certificate.

It is absurd how you think this government, who has played down the seriousness of this to the extent that their have been thousands of unnecessary deaths, is somehow inflating the numbers!

Where are you getting your data on UHCW from? Pillar 1 testing data suggests six cases over the last couple of weeks, seems pretty inconceivable that none of those are in hospital.

Area name Area code Area type Specimen date Daily lab-confirmed cases
Coventry E08000026 Upper tier local authority 01/07/2020 0
Coventry E08000026 Upper tier local authority 30/06/2020 1
Coventry E08000026 Upper tier local authority 27/06/2020 1
Coventry E08000026 Upper tier local authority 23/06/2020 1
Coventry E08000026 Upper tier local authority 20/06/2020 2
Coventry E08000026 Upper tier local authority 19/06/2020 1

Stanley Johnson breaks all manner of rules to fuck off to his holiday home in Greece, I look forward to the excuses for this one.

shmmeee said:

I’ve seen no evidence of mutation to a new strain that’s less dangerous for example.

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I'll cheer you up by at least suggesting we haven't seen evidence of mutation to a new strain that's more dangerous yet, either.

Now there's a thought for a Thursday...

Skybluefaz said:

Stanley Johnson breaks all manner of rules to fuck off to his holiday home in Greece, I look forward to the excuses for this one.

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Eye test.

Saddlebrains said:

Love an argument you do dont you, id hate to see your blood pressure. Chill

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But can you explain how a sovereign currency issuer with it's own central bank can go bankrupt?

Skybluefaz said:

Stanley Johnson breaks all manner of rules to fuck off to his holiday home in Greece, I look forward to the excuses for this one.

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How could he have done that when Greece isn’t letting anyone in from the UK till the 15th?