Wigan gone in to admin (1 Viewer)

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Sky Blue Harry H

Sky Blue Harry H

Well-Known Member
Specs WT-R75 said:
Also don't we want them to stay up? Am I correct that if they don't come out of admin or have certain arrangements in place before the next season starts there is another points deduction as well?
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If they do stay up (or not), presumably they will have to accept offers for their players - as the administrators will want to accrue £££s for their creditors? Won't leave them in a very good position for the following season, so overall I guess we'd want them to stay up. Never liked them much, but harsh on their fans. Hong Kong owners?
 
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Legia Sky Blue

Well-Known Member
This does seem like brinkmanship by the 'new' owners, and slightly dubious. The fact they have done this the day after hitting 50 points, which is commonly deemed as the safety mark in a 46 game season, makes it look a tactical move more than anything. They are not going to get relegated as things stand, so it looks like they are banking on getting their points deduction this season, and as SBH points out, then counting on their team to survive even with a points deduction, whereby they can then start afresh in the Championship next season on level points.
 
Sky Blue Harry H

Sky Blue Harry H

Well-Known Member
wingy said:
What kind of owners?
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That's what their fans are asking! Apparently someone in Hong Kong that has financed it through bank loans (if I read it correctly) Bit odd, as if only bought 4 weeks ago, this all looks like a pre-planned move? Dave Whelan won't be happy!
Having thought about it some more, a few clubs 'safe' but out of the running for play offs may be looking at this and wondering about following suit! It means your players would be touted for sale, but some owners might be happy to take a short term hit. Awful for clubs/fans, but we might just profit from it a bit next season.
 
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mark82

mark82

Moderator
Would be farcical if they gave them a points deduction at the end of the season and they were still safe. Would essentially be no punishment.
 
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thekidfromstrettoncamp

Well-Known Member
Would be nice if someone more company minded (osb58) than me took a look at page 9 on Barnsley website Wigan item said to be from one of their own supporters(Wigan) states that a Doctor Stanley is the main buyer and seller how is that allowed by the EFL? Hope you can make sence not technically minded to bring the post up
 
L

Legia Sky Blue

Well-Known Member
thekidfromstrettoncamp said:
Would be nice if someone more company minded (osb58) than me took a look at page 9 on Barnsley website Wigan item said to be from one of their own supporters(Wigan) states that a Doctor Stanley is the main buyer and seller how is that allowed by the EFL? Hope you can make sence not technically minded to bring the post up
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I WARNED EVERYBODY

Hopefully works!

If this guy is right about what has happened, it is absolutely outrageous!!
 
shepardo01

shepardo01

Well-Known Member
thekidfromstrettoncamp said:
Would be nice if someone more company minded (osb58) than me took a look at page 9 on Barnsley website Wigan item said to be from one of their own supporters(Wigan) states that a Doctor Stanley is the main buyer and seller how is that allowed by the EFL? Hope you can make sence not technically minded to bring the post up
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Similar happened to us.
SBS&L - admin and brought out by otium entertainment (both fronted by SISU)....
Might not be that accurate but we were put into administration and then re-brougt by SISU just under a different company name
 
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thekidfromstrettoncamp

Well-Known Member
shepardo01 said:
Similar happened to us.
SBS&L - admin and brought out by otium entertainment (both fronted by SISU)....
Might not be that accurate but we were put into administration and then re-brougt by SISU just under a different company name
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Didn't like that at the time neither.I really think the way many of these change of ownerships happen makes you wonder how anyone could possibly fail to be fit for owners charter.Another case is Newcastle and the PL in this case have not put a stop to their take over.
 
pipkin73

pipkin73

Well-Known Member
On the radio earlier they said the points deduction will be at the end of this season, so a few wins and they are safe. Similar to Leicester who done it to pay for the new ground (i think after what they done the rules changed). From that article Wigan could be 200k per week in arrears soon, so from the "NEW" owners point of view it makes sense. Next season could see many more follow suit, so a record low points total to be able to stay up. We might just stay up and with the extra years cash build on it and secure a place before building a promotion challenging team.
 
Flying Fokker

Flying Fokker

Well-Known Member
pipkin73 said:
On the radio earlier they said the points deduction will be at the end of this season, so a few wins and they are safe. Similar to Leicester who done it to pay for the new ground (i think after what they done the rules changed). From that article Wigan could be 200k per week in arrears soon, so from the "NEW" owners point of view it makes sense. Next season could see many more follow suit, so a record low points total to be able to stay up. We might just stay up and with the extra years cash build on it and secure a place before building a promotion challenging team.
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Leicester. Points deduction? When?
 
Mcbean

Mcbean

Well-Known Member
Thing is there are a lot of people saying on the efl thread that they should not be deducted points given the prevailing situation - for me we had no choice we lost points and the rules should be followed - there were a number of clubs running insolvently including Leicester and Portsmouth I believe but got away without sanction - can’t be one rule for one and not for another - appreciate it’s not the best for any club And there may be more but we took the pain and got over it !
 
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Covstu

Covstu

Well-Known Member
Mcbean said:
Thing is there are a lot of people saying on the efl thread that they should not be deducted points given the prevailing situation - for me we had no choice we lost points and the rules should be followed - there were a number of clubs running insolvently including Leicester and Portsmouth I believe but got away without sanction - can’t be one rule for one and not for another - appreciate it’s not the best for any club And there may be more but we took the pain and got over it !
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Agree, they got into this position by poor management and COVID has just tipped it over the edge. No doubt it’s having an impact on all clubs but you would have seen a lot more L1 and 2 clubs head in this direction before a club like Wigan. I think one area they may need to flex is putting in more measures prior to clubs going bust ala Bury.
 
Evo1883

Evo1883

Well-Known Member
<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">A thread: How Wigan Athletic have been victim to one of the greatest sporting scandals of all time.</p>&mdash; mark (@marksparko) <a href="">July 3, 2020</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>





Seems there is more to this than meets the eye potentially and its appalling
 
eastwoodsdustman

eastwoodsdustman

Well-Known Member
Evo1883 said:
<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">A thread: How Wigan Athletic have been victim to one of the greatest sporting scandals of all time.</p>&mdash; mark (@marksparko) <a href="">July 3, 2020</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>





Seems there is more to this than meets the eye potentially and its appalling
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Read about this earlier. If it’s true then it’s shocking and the fa should defer the deduction just to stop the bet coming in
 
shepardo01

shepardo01

Well-Known Member
eastwoodsdustman said:
Read about this earlier. If it’s true then it’s shocking and the fa should defer the deduction just to stop the bet coming in
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All sentiment aside, should the FA/EFL not follow their own rules and let the authorities deal with what looks like a bet that is being influenced or fixed for a better word....
 
Sky_Blue_Dreamer

Sky_Blue_Dreamer

Well-Known Member
Well it once again makes a mockery of the fit and proper persons test if a few weeks after the test the club go into admin.
 
Grendel

Grendel

Well-Known Member
So it seems this is going to be a lot lot more complicated than we thought!
 
shepardo01

shepardo01

Well-Known Member
.....imagine the celebration if we had been brought out by these.......
Only then a few weeks later.... something like this happens.
Better the devil you know!....
 
O

oldfiver

Well-Known Member
Wigan Warriors-led bid for Wigan Athletic revealed

WIGAN WARRIORS-LED BID FOR WIGAN ATHLETIC REVEALED
7 Jul 2020 North West Business, Deals
Wigan_Athletic_1-19880-1594118988.jpg

A consortium including the owner of rugby league giant Wigan Warriors is lining up a rescue deal for Wigan Athletic.

Paul Stanley, Gerald Krasner and Dean Watson from Begbies Traynor were appointed as administrators to the Latics on 1 July.

They currently sit 16th in the table after enjoying a good run of form.

Now, a consortium led by Wigan Warriors owner Ian Lenagan, alongside experienced finance executive Gary Speakman and Darryl Eales, a former chief executive of private equity investor LDC, has outlined plans to rescue the club.

"We strongly believe that Wigan Athletic is better being locally-owned," said the trio.

"As sustainability and ownership of the stadium is equally important to both clubs, we are currently working with our longstanding advisers KPMG and talking to external parties.

"Our intention is to identify other investors quickly and start due diligence on the football club with the intention of making a bid in due course. We have made the administrators aware of our interest and hope to explore this with them further over the days ahead."

They added: "Wigan Warriors and Wigan Athletic are both local sporting institutions and it is our belief that this is a unique opportunity here to bring the ownership of these two great clubs together under one roof, each operating independently as before, but under a Wigan Sporting Partnership banner.

"It is envisaged that each club would retain all its training grounds, management and facilities."

David Molyneux, leader of Wigan Council, has confirmed that the authority "would be very supportive of this initiative".
 
oldskyblue58

oldskyblue58

CCFC Finance Director
The EFL really do need a suitably experienced and professional department to look in to the disposals of clubs properly. Clearly what happens now is not up to the job. The checks on owners back grounds and financial means needs to be far more stringent. Prospective owners must be compelled to give all the information necessary. Switching clubs around in a group structure just should not be that easy and should be subject to the same checks as a 3rd party disposal. To go in to administration after 4 weeks frankly stinks. The EFL needs to be more active in monitoring clubs finances, in asking difficult questions, demanding proof and firm undertakings, the clubs need to provide the funding for the service. The EFL also need to say no more often.

Look at the 2019 financials for Wigan and it shows the football operation (two companies operating company & property company) made 10m+ in losses even after player sales near 7m. Losses have to be financed. There was between the two companies £1m in the bank. They had received in that year £10.6m loan from the ultimate parent company. Income in 2020 was not going to increase much (dont know if they had player sales or purchases to include from July 2019 havent checked). The majority of turnover comes from Premier League and EFL distributions so is pretty fixed. Wages would still be more than turnover so losses of at least £10m were to be expected to June 2020 in my opinion. Even before increased interest charges. Have only looked briefly, but the general scenario is similar in many clubs - it is how and by who it is exploited that is a problem.

I assume no one asked whether the parent company or other group companies actually had the funds to support such a cash demand of £10m this year and probably next year - i am guessing but i would think much of the market capitalisation of the ultimate parent company was made up of the amounts owed to it by the Wigan football operation. The football group simply didnt have the ability or the foreseeable prospect of paying that back - so the real market capitalisation is nothing like the figure quoted i would guess.

It is one thing having an owner like the Whelan family but quite another having an owner who has no affinity for the club and sees it as a means to play finance games.

There is another question - if the Whelan family did enough detailed due diligence on the new buyers in the first place ? That is not an accusation just a question, the Whelan family have been tremendously supportive of the club

What a mess and a lesson to many clubs and fans. Feel sorry for the Wigan fans.
 
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Grendel

Grendel

Well-Known Member
oldskyblue58 said:
The EFL really do need a suitably experienced and professional department to look in to the disposals of clubs properly. Clearly what happens now is not up to the job. The checks on owners back grounds and financial means needs to be far more stringent. Prospective owners must be compelled to give all the information necessary. Switching clubs around in a group structure just should not be that easy and should be subject to the same checks as a 3rd party disposal. To go in to administration after 4 weeks frankly stinks. The EFL needs to be more active in monitoring clubs finances, in asking difficult questions, demanding proof and firm undertakings, the clubs need to provide the funding for the service. The EFL also need to say no more often.

Look at the 2019 financials for Wigan and it shows the football operation (two companies operating company & property company) made 10m+ in losses even after player sales near 7m. Losses have to be financed. There was between the two companies £1m in the bank. They had received in that year £10.6m loan from the ultimate parent company. Income in 2020 was not going to increase much (dont know if they had player sales or purchases to include from July 2019 havent checked). The majority of turnover comes from Premier League and EFL distributions so is pretty fixed. Wages would still be more than turnover so losses of at least £10m were to be expected to June 2020 in my opinion. Even before increased interest charges. Have only looked briefly, but the general scenario is similar in many clubs - it is how and by who it is exploited that is the problem.

I assume no one asked whether the parent company or other group companies actually had the funds to support such a cash demand of £10m this year and probably next year - i am guessing but i would think much of the market capitalisation of the ultimate parent company was made up of the amounts owed to it by the Wigan football operation. The football group simply didnt have the ability or the foreseeable prospect of paying that back - so the real market capitalisation is nothing like the figure quoted i would guess.

It is one thing having an owner like the Whelan family but quite another having an owner who has no affinity for the club and sees it as a means to play finance games.

There is another question - if the Whelan family did enough detailed due diligence on the new buyers in the first place ? That is not an accusation just a question, the Whelan family have been tremendously supportive of the club

What a mess and a lesson to many clubs and fans. Feel sorry for the Wigan fans.
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Hasn’t there been a suggestion this is a big betting scandal thing?
 
oldskyblue58

oldskyblue58

CCFC Finance Director
Grendel said:
Hasn’t there been a suggestion this is a big betting scandal thing?
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yes but at this stage its rumour - the administrators are investigating apparently ............ dont hold your breath that they get to the bootom of it
 
Grendel

Grendel

Well-Known Member
oldskyblue58 said:
yes but at this stage its rumour - the administrators are investigating apparently ............ dont hold your breath that they get to the bootom of it
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A fan managed to record a conversation with Rick Parry and it doesn’t sound great
 
Joy Division

Joy Division

Well-Known Member
oldfiver said:
Wigan Warriors-led bid for Wigan Athletic revealed

WIGAN WARRIORS-LED BID FOR WIGAN ATHLETIC REVEALED
7 Jul 2020 North West Business, Deals

Now, a consortium led by Wigan Warriors owner Ian Lenagan, alongside experienced finance executive Gary Speakman and Darryl Eales, a former chief executive of private equity investor LDC, has outlined plans to rescue the club.
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Darryl Eales is the current owner of Solihull Moors
 
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