EFL to end season this week - City likely to be promoted (1 Viewer)

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tisza

tisza

Well-Known Member
Damien Collins reckons 5 to 10 L1/2 clubs could be in admin in the next few weeks. Is it right to make these clubs play if it's going to break them?
These clubs with their own promotion/relegation issues claiming it's for the good of football to carry on, sporting integrity etc. (many with wealthy backers) don't seem worried football could lose clubs.
maybe that's Tranmere's plan drag it out long enough for a few to go into admin and get pts deductions.
 
W

wingy

Well-Known Member
tisza said:
Damien Collins reckons 5 to 10 L1/2 clubs could be in admin in the next few weeks. Is it right to make these clubs play if it's going to break them?
These clubs with their own promotion/relegation issues claiming it's for the good of football to carry on, sporting integrity etc. (many with wealthy backers) don't seem worried football could lose clubs.
maybe that's Tranmere's plan drag it out long enough for a few to go into admin and get pts deductions.
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I think the biggest enemy is delay .
There seems to have been a ridiculous amount of that .
This league by league approach has been shit .
 
Terry_dactyl

Terry_dactyl

Well-Known Member
I can’t help but think that the EFL would’ve spoken to the ‘gang of 6’ prior to today’s announcement, to determine what offer it would take to make the majority of them (Pompey, Fleetwood, Oxford) to change their stance.
The EFL wants the season ended...surely this would’ve happened?
 
Y

Yorkshire SB

Well-Known Member
pfceggchaser said:
It’s not about promotion, this is about the pyramid. L1 and 2 are in massive trouble here.

I don’t blame you. You’ve got a chance to go up by voting for yourselves and that in turn secured your future. It’ll never happen again.

But if L1 doesn’t come back, that’s it for L1 football for 12 months imo. Won’t affect you. Could affect us if we lose. Will affect Sunderland and Ipswich.

It’ll be something like 14-9 in your favour imo.
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And what does ‘principle’ and voting to play on do to help that situation? It doesn’t, it only exacerbates and accelerates the process. You’re asking owners to fork out £500k to bankroll every club through this period. What about the players, most will probably will be facing redundancy or a significant pay cut in the coming weeks/months and yet they’ve got to play on. Might be okay for the richer clubs who can provide some security but most can’t. Until there’s a mid-term solution, why are clubs who have nothing in the bank just going to throw money up the wall.

You’re right that the pyramid is at risk, but it’s nonsense to suggest that playing on does anything to help that.
 
Otis

Otis

Well-Known Member
SeaSeeEffCee said:
Peterborough are acting like they were 10 points clear at the top and robbed of promotion. Imagine reading some of shite they're coming out with about facing incredibly injustice and finding out it's because they didn't manage to scrape into the play-offs.
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It is rather embarrassing. I do have some sympathy with their plight, but to cry of complete injustice and almost outrage at the decision, is a bit pathetic.

The 'principle' thing the Pompey fan is taking of, is also a nonsense. Nothing to do with principle at all and is all out of pure self-interest. If any of these 6 clubs were in first or second place, there would be absolutely zero talk of any principle.

Back with Peterborough, they only want any principle that sees them in the playoff positions, should the season curtail right now.
 
Sky Blue Pete

Sky Blue Pete

Well-Known Member
Otis said:
It is rather embarrassing. I do have some sympathy with their plight, but to cry of complete injustice and almost outrage at the decision, is a bit pathetic.

The 'principle' thing the Pompey fan is taking of, is also a nonsense. Nothing to do with principle at all and is all out of pure self-interest. If any of these 6 clubs were in first or second place, there would be absolutely zero talk of any principle.

Back with Peterborough, they only want any principle that sees them in the playoff positions, should the season curtail right now.
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What’s the principle stuff they’re going on about?
 
Y

Yorkshire SB

Well-Known Member
Sky Blue Pete said:
What’s the principle stuff they’re going on about?
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Suggesting it’s not about promotion for them (or some of the other clubs), it’s about the long term future of the third tier, but fair play to us for only being concerned about promotion.

Of course this makes no sense, and playing would only accelerate issues.
 
C

covboy1987

Well-Known Member
wingy said:
I think the biggest enemy is delay .
There seems to have been a ridiculous amount of that .
This league by league approach has been shit .
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The worrying concern is the delay, but more worrying is the reason for the delay as from afar the EFL seem to be dithering in decision making - But is there a reason we do not know about ? Maybe a legal reason (are the rules tight enough) or are there threats from several clubs that have got together, that if they do not get their own way they are throwing the towel in
 
Flying Fokker

Flying Fokker

Well-Known Member
covboy1987 said:
The worrying concern is the delay, but more worrying is the reason for the delay as from afar the EFL seem to be dithering in decision making - But is there a reason we do not know about ? Maybe a legal reason (are the rules tight enough) or are there threats from several clubs that have got together, that if they do not get their own way they are throwing the towel in
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Most of these footy clubs micro manage their operations. Not much extra will have been spent in waiting for this to play out. Furlough scheme yes. But day to day maintenance as well.
 
C

covboy1987

Well-Known Member
Flying Fokker said:
Most of these footy clubs micro manage their operations. Not much extra will have been spent in waiting for this to play out. Furlough scheme yes. But day to day maintenance as well.
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I would say the likes of our club is micro managed carefully, but for many of the clubs this is far from reality as because it is football spend way above there means
 
mark82

mark82

Moderator
pfceggchaser said:
They’ll vote to play on. There’s no way when they entered the group of 6 teams they would go back on that, especially when the EFL board’s preferred position does technically remain to play on.

I think you’ll win the vote. It’ll not be as big a margin as you think.
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The Fleetwood chairman has said that they may vote PPG if they were guaranteed playoffs. Think their main issue was when there was talk of promoting 3rd place or only promoting 2 teams.
 
mark82

mark82

Moderator
Specs WT-R75 said:
West Ham & Bournemouth have both played 29 games. They have both played the exact same number of Home (14) and Away games (15). They both have the same number of points, and West Ham have a better goal difference. Under wPPG Bournemouth move above West Ham.

So what this means is that wPPG is not basing the results of the league based on the results of the 29 games, in actual fact it is deciding based on the predicted results of the remaining 9 games. That's a massive concept change from what PPG is trying to do.

Once you get into the prediction game we are going to have to start looking at which teams have top half teams to play away from home and so on. You open a massive can of worms with wPPG.

Edited to update home/away number.
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Weighted PPG isn't really a prediction any more than straight PPG. Teams like Peterborough are very strong at home, so wPPG allows for this (and would've put Peterborough top 6). If you started looking at opponents and weighting for that it would be prediction, but wPPG Vs PPG is just an alternative statistical model.

Frankly, I don't care. If it's PPG we go up. If it's wPPG we go up. If we play on we go up (it would take a collapse of monumental proportions not to).
 
shmmeee

shmmeee

Well-Known Member
mark82 said:
The Fleetwood chairman has said that they may vote PPG if they were guaranteed playoffs. Think their main issue was when there was talk of promoting 3rd place or only promoting 2 teams.
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Any team in the top 6 would be nuts not to vote PPG. The wailing from the anti-PPG lot should tell you that it’s basically a done deal.
 
mark82

mark82

Moderator
pfceggchaser said:
It’s not about promotion, this is about the pyramid. L1 and 2 are in massive trouble here.

I don’t blame you. You’ve got a chance to go up by voting for yourselves and that in turn secured your future. It’ll never happen again.

But if L1 doesn’t come back, that’s it for L1 football for 12 months imo. Won’t affect you. Could affect us if we lose. Will affect Sunderland and Ipswich.

It’ll be something like 14-9 in your favour imo.
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I don't think Championship would start without the rest of the EFL. They'd need to maintain the integrity of the pyramid and teams won't survive with no football. There's no way next season gets cancelled (though I could see a shortened format).
 
M

Magwitch

Well-Known Member
mark82 said:
The Fleetwood chairman has said that they may vote PPG if they were guaranteed playoffs. Think their main issue was when there was talk of promoting 3rd place or only promoting 2 teams.
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Despite what the EFL said yesterday especially the relegation issue I still think there’s a way to go yet. Reading the EFL statement the clubs in the promotion positions will go up 100% of that I’m certain happy days, , but their idea for the third promotion spot, fourth in league 2 to happen via play-offs i don’t think is certain. That then I believe brings in what happens with the Premiership. I still think there are big doubts they will or can play the season out which might then bring in the no relegation from the Prem and the division to be expanded but if they do that will it be to 22 or 23 clubs
 
Philosorapter

Philosorapter

Well-Known Member
I can see some of the clubs press statements soon be around the lines of:

Whilst our club has always maintained that the season should be concluded on the pitch it is now starting to become apparent that the timeframe to deliver a successful conclusion to this years campaign has now passed. It is in these unique circumstances and with a heavy heart we will now be voting for PPG to curtail the season early.
 
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Moff

Moff

Well-Known Member
Really interesting article on the BBC website today, re the struggle through Covid for lowers league teams.

One interesting piece with quotes from the Burton Chairman Ben Robinson, and the renowned sports finance academic Dr Rob Wilson from Sheffield Hallam Uni, about the selfishness of the few and how smaller clubs may collapse if forced to play on.

“”League One talks last week stalled after at least six clubs in the third tier, including Sunderland, Portsmouth and Ipswich Town, said they wanted to continue the season.

Robinson refers to clubs with "vested interests", while finance expert Dr Wilson calls it "self-interest".

"It will threaten the final operations at a number of clubs in that division, no doubt whatsoever," Wilson said of playing out the season in the third tier.

"They will hardly be able to afford to test their players for coronavirus, let alone pay their wages.

"It is all well and good having a couple of big teams trying to dictate what should happen when in reality they have 23 teams that they need to look out for."
 
S

steve cooper

Well-Known Member
Liquid Gold said:
Genuinely don't get that when they have as much change of finishing 8th as they do getting automatics. Take the 25% chance.
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I still think that some clubs will be saying one thing to the general public, but may vote a different way. It's all about PR. Will we ever find out which way every team voted? and even if we do, they can just say something like, after careful consideration we voted to save other clubs from obliteration, and to possibly save lives.
 
Liquid Gold

Liquid Gold

Well-Known Member
Moff said:
Really interesting article on the BBC website today, re the struggle through Covid for lowers league teams.

One interesting piece with quotes from the Burton Chairman Ben Robinson, and the renowned sports finance academic Dr Rob Wilson from Sheffield Hallam Uni, about the selfishness of the few and how smaller clubs may collapse if forced to play on.

“”League One talks last week stalled after at least six clubs in the third tier, including Sunderland, Portsmouth and Ipswich Town, said they wanted to continue the season.

Robinson refers to clubs with "vested interests", while finance expert Dr Wilson calls it "self-interest".

"It will threaten the final operations at a number of clubs in that division, no doubt whatsoever," Wilson said of playing out the season in the third tier.

"They will hardly be able to afford to test their players for coronavirus, let alone pay their wages.

"It is all well and good having a couple of big teams trying to dictate what should happen when in reality they have 23 teams that they need to look out for."
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That's what it is, self interest. If they came out and said "I need to look after my team not the others" they might be shits but at least they'd be honest shits. This integrity thing is a load of bollocks.

The Fleetwood chairman gets me, was calling for regional divisions as they couldn't afford to continue but now want to play on?
 
Liquid Gold

Liquid Gold

Well-Known Member
steve cooper said:
I still think that some clubs will be saying one thing to the general public, but may vote a different way. It's all about PR. Will we ever find out which way every team voted? and even if we do, they can just say something like, after careful consideration we voted to save other clubs from obliteration, and to possibly save lives.
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Yeah, would like to know if it's a secret ballot or not.
 
Liquid Gold

Liquid Gold

Well-Known Member
Also I'd like to add that if the season were to resume I fully expect Rotherham to finish 2nd anyway. They may have been on a bad run before this all kicked off but runs come to an end and form goes out the window. Of the pack they are the only ones with recent experience of how to get out of this league and are a big strong organised side.
 
tisza

tisza

Well-Known Member
Liquid Gold said:
That's what it is, self interest. If they came out and said "I need to look after my team not the others" they might be shits but at least they'd be honest shits. This integrity thing is a load of bollocks.

The Fleetwood chairman gets me, was calling for regional divisions as they couldn't afford to continue but now want to play on?
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Struggle to feel sorry for Fleetwood as they've a wage bill in excess of their turnover and continued to spend money. One of the largest wage bills in the Division without the crowds to support it.
 
shmmeee

shmmeee

Well-Known Member
Liquid Gold said:
Also I'd like to add that if the season were to resume I fully expect Rotherham to finish 2nd anyway. They may have been on a bad run before this all kicked off but runs come to an end and form goes out the window. Of the pack they are the only ones with recent experience of how to get out of this league and are a big strong organised side.
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I think they were probably the best side I saw us play this season. They deserve to go up.
 
clint van damme

clint van damme

Well-Known Member
Apologies if mentioned but it said on 5live that league one clubs are meeting today.
Didn't mention a vote.
 
covcity4life

covcity4life

Well-Known Member
Liquid Gold said:
Also I'd like to add that if the season were to resume I fully expect Rotherham to finish 2nd anyway. They may have been on a bad run before this all kicked off but runs come to an end and form goes out the window. Of the pack they are the only ones with recent experience of how to get out of this league and are a big strong organised side.
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Lol
 
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