Hickman Listed (2 Viewers)

stevefloyd

Well-Known Member
I would think if the club thought he was going to be a good player they may have been a little more lenient but as it happens that didn't happen
 

oucho

Well-Known Member
I think he should only be moved on for footballing reasons. Don't bin him off for acting like a knob, we would shoot ourselves in the foot by doing so.
 

larry_david

Well-Known Member
Extremely curious to see how this plays out. Very highly rated 2 years ago, I imagine before this outburst a league 2 loan would have been on the cards. One thing's for sure he's got motivation to do well
 

shmmeee

Well-Known Member
I think he should only be moved on for footballing reasons. Don't bin him off for acting like a knob, we would shoot ourselves in the foot by doing so.

Would you ever kick a player out for non football reasons?
 

Mr Panda

Well-Known Member
Extremely curious to see how this plays out. Very highly rated 2 years ago, I imagine before this outburst a league 2 loan would have been on the cards. One thing's for sure he's got motivation to do well

I can't claim to have seen him play much but I feel like he would have been in and around the first team a bit more had he been of a certain calibre.

The right back position, plus backup rightback have been open-ish for the last two seasons but people like Jordan Thompson have deputised on the odd occasion
 

oucho

Well-Known Member
I'm not sure it is harsh. If I slagged off my employer and/or their customers on social media I'd be sacked. I've seen it happen on a number of occasions to other people.

But in football, good talents are precious. A decent player is not as easily replaceable as someone in a normal job. We only stand to benefit from his performances if he improves his attitude thanks to some disciplinary measures. No point cutting our noses off just to be hard headed.
 

Nick

Administrator
But in football, good talents are precious. A decent player is not as easily replaceable as someone in a normal job. We only stand to benefit from his performances if he improves his attitude thanks to some disciplinary measures. No point cutting our noses off just to be hard headed.

Is he that good or precious?
 

oucho

Well-Known Member
Is he that good or precious?

I honestly don't know. I was talking more "in principle" rather than his specific case i.e. if we'd otherwise want to keep hold him, don't kick him out for the sake of his social media faux pas.
 

mark82

Moderator
I honestly don't know. I was talking more "in principle" rather than his specific case i.e. if we'd otherwise want to keep hold him, don't kick him out for the sake of his social media faux pas.

Yeah, I get that. If it was Bayliss that did the same, the response would be different. Just saying the actions taken against Hickman aren't harsh, they're probably more lenient than the real world.
 

shmmeee

Well-Known Member
But in football, good talents are precious. A decent player is not as easily replaceable as someone in a normal job. We only stand to benefit from his performances if he improves his attitude thanks to some disciplinary measures. No point cutting our noses off just to be hard headed.

What cost the future academy players though?

Just devils advocate, hypothetical: if there was an issue identified in the academy that this sort of attitude was stopping several players reaching their potential. Would it be worth sacrificing one to save more in the future?
 

oucho

Well-Known Member
What cost the future academy players though?

Just devils advocate, hypothetical: if there was an issue identified in the academy that this sort of attitude was stopping several players reaching their potential. Would it be worth sacrificing one to save more in the future?

You'd achieve the same deterrent effect by disciplining such players e.g. fine them, make them play for a week with the lower age groups, etc - rather than straight binning them off. Otherwise, the risk is that we get rid of a player we'd otherwise keep and another club goes on to benefit from our investment in that player through our academy system.
 

skyblue1991

Well-Known Member
No, I didn't, man was a grade a c**t, as were those chanting "She loved it" etc.
Didn't condone the 'she said yes Marlon' or 'shes a slag Marlon' chants form our fans, however I supported Kingwhilst he was with us. He served his time and returned to his career as any normal human would do after a spell in jail.

P.S. 6500 Leeds fans chanting 'she said no marlon' reamins to be one of the funniest chants I have heard in football!
 

Sky_Blue_Dreamer

Well-Known Member
Although bad taste, I thought the "Van Persie - if a girl says no, molest her" to Rewind by Craig David was quite witty in its way.

I think "There's Only Two Andy Goram's" remains my favourite
 

CJ_covblaze

Well-Known Member
Didn't condone the 'she said yes Marlon' or 'shes a slag Marlon' chants form our fans, however I supported Kingwhilst he was with us. He served his time and returned to his career as any normal human would do after a spell in jail.

P.S. 6500 Leeds fans chanting 'she said no marlon' reamins to be one of the funniest chants I have heard in football!

Footballers work within the community including with children so they should hold enhanced DBS checks. If they can't get one it's tough luck. I'm all for giving people a second chance when they've spent time at Her Majesty's pleasure but would a teacher be allowed to go back to his or her job after that conviction? They would have to change their career. King is no different.
 

Mucca Mad Boys

Well-Known Member
Footballers work within the community including with children so they should hold enhanced DBS checks. If they can't get one it's tough luck. I'm all for giving people a second chance when they've spent time at Her Majesty's pleasure but would a teacher be allowed to go back to his or her job after that conviction? They would have to change their career. King is no different.

The key difference is teachers work with minors on a day-to-day basis. Footballers don’t.

They have community commitments and engagements, but that’s not an essential characteristic of their job. I’m all for keeping criminals being banned from those engagements, but not from football.
 

CJ_covblaze

Well-Known Member
The key difference is teachers work with minors on a day-to-day basis. Footballers don’t.

They have community commitments and engagements, but that’s not an essential characteristic of their job. I’m all for keeping criminals being banned from those engagements, but not from football.

In this day and age it is.
 

shmmeee

Well-Known Member
In this day and age it is.

Disagree. It’s a nice to have but it’s not essential. I’d be pissed if I couldn’t do my job because of something unrelated to the core competencies.

Also, if you’ve served your time you’ve done your crime. I’ve worked with ex cons who have gone into schools and they’ve been some of the best mentors kids can have. Who you are matters more than what you’ve done and there’s plenty of “innocent” footballers I’d want nowhere near kids.
 

Mucca Mad Boys

Well-Known Member
In this day and age it is.

No it isn’t, the community engagements footballers have are extra-curricular to their normal work day.

The comparison with teachers was a poor example whichever way you look at it.

If you want to make the case that all criminals should be banned from football, fine. I’d still disagree, but that’s another debate.
 

lordsummerisle

Well-Known Member
Disagree. It’s a nice to have but it’s not essential. I’d be pissed if I couldn’t do my job because of something unrelated to the core competencies.

Also, if you’ve served your time you’ve done your crime. I’ve worked with ex cons who have gone into schools and they’ve been some of the best mentors kids can have. Who you are matters more than what you’ve done and there’s plenty of “innocent” footballers I’d want nowhere near kids.

Would agree if it was a one off youthful indiscretion, served his time, remorseful, and turned over a new leaf etc

Not the case with King though, already had 14 convictions, including 2 custodial sentences, before joining us, and has been jailed again since.
 

shmmeee

Well-Known Member
Would agree if it was a one off youthful indiscretion, served his time, remorseful, and turned over a new leaf etc

Not the case with King though, already had 14 convictions, including 2 custodial sentences, before joining us, and has been jailed again since.

I’d argue with King he probably falls into the “wouldn’t let him near kids even with a clean record” camp.

As for getting his job back: well I still think if you’ve serves your time you should be back as a full member of society. (Before anyone jumps in about pedos: we put them on the sex offenders register for life so it could be argued they’ve never served their time)
 

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